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Searched for: simmons
06 Apr 2022 09:47
  • Mattrebuild
  • Mattrebuild's Avatar
Well, I have some good news and some bad news to report. Bad news is that the new mattress cover seems to have made the mattress stiffer for some reason (not exactly what we wanted). My wife complained about her shoulder being sore (night before she slept great) and I noticed pressure points that I didn't have a problem with prior either as well as some hip rotation (lack of travel in rear when back sleeping). It's obviously at least partly a tension problem but I need to have another look to see if there's some combination of the sheets being tighter (total height with the cover is about 1" taller) or if the mattress cover being thicker is an issue or if the cover being too tight may be causing this issue. If it turns out that the mattress cover itself is causing the issue I have a few ways to fix it (possibly modifying the top of Purple mattress cover to zip onto the Flobeds mattress cover bottom). For now we'll just pull the mattress cover off and replace it with the mattress pad that did work until I can figure out a solution.
The really good news though was that I used the new massage gun and in a few minutes it had me pain free up and running around this morning way better than I ever have before. Anyway I like to report both the good and the bad but it looks like I have a bit more engineering to go before I can call this one done.
05 Apr 2022 16:24
  • Mattrebuild
  • Mattrebuild's Avatar
Finally got the new mattress cover from Flobeds and it blows away what I had before from Purple. While assembling the mattress I was a bit concerned that maybe I didn’t calculate the layer height correctly but once it was all zipped up it fit perfectly and the feeling was amazing. I was also worried that it might change the feel of the layers below but if anything it feels better not worse. Now it really looks as good as it feels. I was thinking it might be a bit overpriced too but when you see it in person you’ll know why it costs as much as it does, this thing just oozes quality. Cover is made of a stretchy cotton and wool so it doesn’t feel too hot even when you sink right into the bed. Very impressed so far. I also got the extra V-zone talalay pieces I needed to hopefully tweak my side to get my alignment where I want it. I’ll post an update for that once I get it nailed down. The new cover certainly makes changing zones a breeze since the zipper is now on the top instead of the bottom. Overall super impressed with how it’s all coming together.

Not totally mattress related but perhaps helpful for others in a similar situation. In an effort to deal with my bad hip/lower back (from my prior bad mattress) I decided to treat myself to a Theragun Pro G4 massage gun. This is their top of the line offering (ie what the pro sports teams use). I’ve had that bed injury nagging me constantly for quite a while but after just 1/2 hour of using the gun it was just incredible how all the tension and pain melted away. These are not cheap items at all (retails for $600 but you can get brand new ones on ebay for around $400) but when consider what a massage therapist costs, I can easily justify it. It literally feels like you just got a really deep massage when you’re done. Also has an app on your phone that works via bluetooth to guide you on what to do but haven’t played much with it honestly. Anyway this thing was worth every penny if you have the budget for it.
01 Apr 2022 09:53
  • Mattrebuild
  • Mattrebuild's Avatar

i dont 100% get it, but i get what your saying (if that makes sense)

there are so many design variables, it makes it really challenging, but also fun to learn about, but also frustrating with limited DIY sourcing options for most folk (especially here on the east coast)

you rely so much on heresy on forums trying to gather enough information to make intelligent choices without having seen/touch/felt anything. and you have people who can literally sleep on anything (my wife) and you'll read their weight and height, not realizing their build is super soft, but it doesnt bother them vs me who's got an INSANELY temperamental back (have degenerative disc disease)

it would be a lot easier if there was a show room with all the different talalay and dunlop layers under one roof, and you got to just mix, match, and play a bit. granted you still may not get it right on the first try, but you'd be a lot closer the first time around

after now 3 nights on 34d/34d/24t, my back is SIGNIFICANTLY happier. so i'm confident the 36 layer will add a touch more support, and we might be off and running! which i'm super excited about, so thank you! i would have 100% ordered a 32t which wouldn't have fixed anything

right now the thing for me that seems to be the biggest design challenge is, my butt/hips are just way heavier than my upper body, so i just dont know how you design around that. thats why i was thinking that the upper most layer has to be soft enough so that all the body parts sink to the same plane else you are already creating a hammock in a way just in the first 3 inches. heck maybe for heavier people, a 3" topper might not be best, perhaps a 2" super soft, and a 2" med-firm. sink through the top and get everything down to the same plane, then start to hit the support

if i had to start over, i'd honestly be eyeing: 6" 36(t or d) / 2" 32t/ 2" 24t

Sounds like you have a very similar situation to mine. My wife is only half my size and can sleep on just about anything. A while back I managed to injure myself in bed on an expensive mattress that was only a few months old (likely due to severe hammocking). This makes my hips/lower back super sensitive to misalignment while sitting or sleeping and making it pretty much impossible to get an off the shelf mattress that works for me anymore. I started my DIY journey because 1) the mattress industry quality has been going downhill fast (spent a ton of money and got crap) and 2) the pain and lack of sleep was driving me insane.

You can read all about my build here:

It's very clear to me that you were definitely lacking support (hammocking) which was messing with your alignment and causing you pain. So great news you're getting closer to your goal. The 36T was definitely the right layer to get next and that should be even closer to what you want. To answer your heavier hips question, you need to use zoning to fix that issue. Have a look at the end of my build thread link above and you'll see what my current layer setup looks like. So if you still feel like you can't quite get the hip alignment correct (often a hip rotation issue even after the hammocking problem is fixed) and given that you have degenerative disc disease, I would then put a Flobed V-zone in as your 2nd layer (so it would be 34D/36T/VZone/24). I know the V-zone is expensive ($600) but nothing else will give you that level of alignment adjustability if it turns out you need it. Eventually you may want to swap in a 32T as well to give you additional cradling (travel) but that would be a last step. If you were just starting out (knowing what I do so far on your situation) I would have suggested 36T/32T/VZone/22T (all 3" layers). That's obviously not the case so the key here is to continue to make progress incrementally. You may try something that doesn't work but that's fine, realize it's just part of the DIY process and move on. Don't get stuck like I did trying to resuse layers that don't work for you just because you spent money on them. I also spent alot of money learning the differnce between dunlop and talalay too but you quickly realize the end result makes the entire effort worth it.
01 Apr 2022 08:19
  • Mattrebuild
  • Mattrebuild's Avatar
The fact that you want to build a queen instead of a king makes things a bit more complicated (precut split layers really only come in twin XL). Good news is at least you know what it would entail to be successful and then you can decide the best way to proceed given your specific situation. Alot of folks start down the DIY road without understanding what's really involved and whether they are actually up to the task of seeing it through. Where I am up in Canada I litterally could not buy a prebuilt mattress that worked for me so DIY was really my only choice (perhaps unlimited budget I may have found something good enough eventually). I also had to increase my budget quite a bit more than I originally expected but after litterally getting injured sleeping (never would have thought that was even possible) I was determined to solve the problem once and for all. Very happy I went that route myself but again it''s not for everyone and it's also good to know your own limitations.

Here's my build thread which you may find useful as well:
14 Mar 2022 18:00
  • lantern71
  • lantern71's Avatar
Wow mattrebuild! I just read through this thread in its entirety for the first time and it makes my mattress journey look simply by comparison. Some great info here.
14 Mar 2022 04:26
  • buttercupbetty
  • buttercupbetty's Avatar
What a bummer! Hopefully it will arrive soon.
I look forward to hearing your full report.
14 Mar 2022 01:37
  • Mattrebuild
  • Mattrebuild's Avatar

Wow! What a journey. You have done an enormous amount of research.

Did you get a Flobeds cover? Maybe I missed that post. I'm curious to know how it worked :)

Thanks for sharing so much info!

Thanks to ongoing covid nonsense from the Feds in Canada both the Flobeds cover and the additional pieces to fix the zoning on my side are still sitting at the border. I should have them soon and I’ll definitely update the thread when I get it all installed.
13 Mar 2022 21:36
  • buttercupbetty
  • buttercupbetty's Avatar
Wow! What a journey. You have done an enormous amount of research.

Did you get a Flobeds cover? Maybe I missed that post. I'm curious to know how it worked :)

Thanks for sharing so much info!
13 Mar 2022 18:25
  • Mattrebuild
  • Mattrebuild's Avatar

Sounds like you're saying that rarely does a person NOT like zoning....it just might not be "needed" for average sleepers?
I don't see the vZone listed separately on their website....so I sent an email inquiring on price.

Can you share how you built your mattress and where you sourced your layers? Also, about what was your total cost?

Thanks for all the info!!!

That’s exactly right. Most people can get away without zoning and of course adding zoning increases both the cost and complexity of the mattress. I put a premium on getting a good night’s sleep so to me the ability to solve certain issues that give me a truly restful sleep are more than worth it.

Scroll down to v-zone to buy the layer only.

My mattress design is pretty extreme in terms of a DIY but it works great for us (wife’s side is perfect and mine’s very close). It also shows you what is possible doing something completely custom, you can read all about what I did here.
13 Mar 2022 17:40
  • mojowcs
  • mojowcs's Avatar
Thanks for answering my questions. I just placed an order for a 10inch organic. This will replace my 13 year old Simmons Natural Care Hartwell Valley plush which is showing some noticeable body impressions.
09 Mar 2022 20:48
  • JBR2022
  • JBR2022's Avatar
the innersprings I purchased were Simmons Beautyrest and Serta. I'm 6'2, 200 lbs male and probably need more support under waist and lower part of back.
22 Feb 2022 13:53
  • NikkiTMU
  • NikkiTMU's Avatar
Hi lecheandia.

Welcome to our Mattress Forum. :)

Thanks for sharing your stats and current sleeping experience. I'm unsure, but does the 12/08 mean it was manufactured in Dec 2008? If so, it's well time to buy a new bed as - based on what you're describing on the mattress - the materials have worn and begun to break down in a way that no longer offers adequate support to your body.

Are you looking to replace your mattress with a similar model, or are you looking for something entirely different? If you're looking for the current version of this model, the tag information would allow a Beautyrest representative to identify and share with you their closest replacement to that model.

If you're looking for something with better durability and different materials, I'm happy to help guide you towards something new! What are your must haves from a mattress? What are you hoping to feel/experience on a new bed?

20 Feb 2022 12:29
  • lecheandia
  • lecheandia's Avatar
We are looking for a replacement for a Simmons Beautyrest (My original mattress) Manufactured 12/08. I cant find the tag with the name, but it is a Model: M20423.70.7415 Prototype ID: MPD101, MPD583, MPD506.

The bed is a queen size, mattress height 12"
I am a side sleeper, Weight over 290lbs
This mattress still not bad but my side has compressed and does not support my spine and creates backache for me unless I add a 4' long x 6"high foam "wedge" underneath my upper body and pillows.
The edges on my side of the bed have become not firm over time and when sitting on the edge it feels as if I am sliding over side.
If I roll into center of bed it feels as a hard center, likely the center support below the frame prevents sag. Result is still back pain.

My spouse is a 80% side, 20% back. Moderate weight. Is comfortable.
Have rotated bed over the years but no real improvement.
Bed sits on frame which is in turn supported by three slats with center post to limit center sag.

I do not understand the coding on the bed tag so not sure what going back to Beautyrest would do.
16 Feb 2022 10:32
  • BMG
  • BMG's Avatar

Here's the whole thread: themattressunderground.com/mattress-forum/index/22737-simmons-beautyrest-mattress-rebuild?start=0

I have been reading your thread; captivating. I am about halfway through (I'll finish it later) and have to see how the story turns out, but so far I have come to a lot of the same conclusions you have, and identify with your persistence and need to tinker. I wanted to yell out early on "Zoning! You need zones, and custom zones, not the predetermined ones, because they never fit everyone perfectly, and, as you noticed, small changes can make a big difference. Having the zone be 1cm off can mean the difference between pleasure and pain." I was going to mention Flobeds and suggest you cut or have them cut custom sizes.

I also believe that, unless you want to firm up your latex mattress, a stretchy case is important to let the foam expand. Using an adjustable air bed as a base is a smart idea. The same thing can more or less be accomplished by swapping cores in an all latex mattress, but obviously is more of a hassle, and probably won't let you dial in as precisely. I also like the idea of buying a foam saw.

At this point, I am coming to the conclusion that all mattresses need to be adjustable to ideally fit a person (and not up/down adjustable like most adjustable bases do, but adjustable zoning). You can get close with the right set up, at least for one sleeping position, but the idea that any consistent spring rate can perfectly adapt to your body is a lie, let alone do it in different positions. I wonder how a human body would have to look, for each sleeping position, for a non-zoned mattress to perfectly conform and support - is that even a possible body? A mattress really has to be bespoke to fit you well, not ito of overall firmness but zoning, and you probably need 2 sides (like a split king) for each person: one for back/stomach and one for side sleeping if you are a combination sleeper, or combination user (side sleep but sit/lie in bed on your back to work or relax).

The interesting question to me right now is the best way to accomplish this: you can use pillows/bolsters instead of zones, have bespoke zones in your mattress, or have an adjustable base of some kind, either one that is motorized and has a lumbar/shoulder position that can raise/lower (although it probably will not be a perfect size/latitude) or a Euro-slat or -tile-style adjustable base, of which there are many. Right now I am exploring various Euro-slat/tile designs and am keen to see if it makes more sense to do the zoning in the base or in the comfort layer, or to do both.

Haven't gotten to the latex stress/strain graphs yet.

PS If you ever need more pressure relief and want more of a pillow-top feel, you can try a shredded latex topper (or a convoluted topper, which would be halfway in plushness between solid and shredded. It's a mess, but some, like the Flobeds shredded topper, have baffles that can be individually adjusted with fill (the whole side zips open), so you can do some micro-zoning in the pillow-top layer).
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