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Searched for: prana
07 Mar 2017 11:24
  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
Hi hersplash,

Welcome to the Mattress Forum! :)

I bought a Prana Samadhi 4 Queen almost 5 years ago for my adjustable bed. It was fine in the beginning but developed deep impressions after only a few years. It has been unbearable for the last 2. The company determined it was defective after having significant bumps

I’m sorry that your Prana mattress isn’t working out well for you. :(

Oddly the significant bump they found is not where I sleep. Furthermore, I only weigh 100 pounds so it seems strange that I could make such an impact. However, a sales person said heavier people create less impressions because their weight is more distributed. Is that true?

I can’t see your mattress so I can’t speak to what was deemed a “defect” in the product or speculate why that may have happened. And using a power foundation could have caused some issues within the product as well.

Lower density foams will tend to be less durable, regardless of weight, but people with a higher mass will tend to “wear out” materials faster with more mechanical stress than someone with less mass. If someone is smaller and only sleeps in one area of a mattress, you may notice more readily any resulting body impressions or phantom/virtual body impressions, versus someone who was so large that they used the entire mattress at once (which would be a rather large individual) or someone who was a “traveler” and used the entire mattress every night, but…I wouldn’t agree with your salesperson on that particular statement (mass and area covered aren’t necessarily related).

I now have a credit of $4699 at the store. I do not need the base, just the mattress. I tried out and liked the Prana Super Vinyasa 5 Super Plush. That would be $4099.

This mattress uses a 6” Talalay latex core, on top of which is 3” of Talalay latex and 3” of polyfoam. The blend of the latex is not provided (although it is alluded to on the Prana web site that it is 100% NR), and there is no information provide about the density of the polyfoam, which would be important to know. This mattress is somewhat similar in design to your old mattress, but not exactly the same. I would always make sure that you find out the information listed here so you can compare the quality of the materials and components to the durability guidelines here to make sure there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress that would be a cause for concern relative to the durability and useful life of a mattress before making any purchase.

But I also liked the Tempur-pedic Flex Supreme Breeze Plush at $3799.

This obviously is a different style of mattress from your current latex product. The Flex Supreme Breeze uses a pocketed coil innerspring unit, on top of which is 2.5” of 1.6 lb polyfoam, 1” of 5.3 lb Tempur memory foam and 2” of 4 lb Tempur memory foam. This mattress is adjustable bed friendly. For your mass, there would be no concerns with the density of any of these materials, but I would advise caution for those in a slightly higher with range with the 2.5" of 1.6 lb polyfoam and the 2" of 4 lb memory foam..

I don’t recall trying out all the Tempur-pedics so I was going to go back and try the Countour Rhapsody Luxe, Countour Elite Breeze and Flex Supreme Breeze (no plush) just because they are higher price points.

While you have a rather larger credit to work with at this store, make sure to choose any product based upon the quality of componentry and the appropriateness for your sleeping style and personal preferences, and not only trying to use all of the credit you have available. I don't think this is the case, but I wanted to mention it just to be sure.

Also, I did really like the Serta Icomfort Savant 3 Plush but at $1774 but I would be leaving close to $3000 on the table.

I’d advise caution with selecting this particular model and make sure that you find out (if possible) all of the specifications of the layers contained within that mattress. The major brands such as Sealy/Stearns & Foster, Simmons, and Serta all tend to use lower quality and less durable materials in their mattresses that will tend to soften or break down prematurely relative to the price you pay which is why I would generally suggest avoiding all of them completely regardless of how they may feel in a showroom along with any mattress where you aren't able to find out the type and quality/durability of the materials inside it (see the guidelines here along with post #3 here and post #12 here and post #404 here ).

And no, they won’t let me buy 2 or 3. I asked

Nice try! :lol: At least they are offering you the choice of other items, instead of simply sending you out a replacement of the same mattress.

I use the adjustable bed all day long with the back raised, so one of my concerns again is the impressions. Also, I often use a heating pad on my back, which I’ve heard is not good for the Tempur-pedic.

You are correct, Tempurpedic does not recommend the use of a heating pad with their products.

I am a side sleeper, have many back problems and Fibromyalgia. Currently my knees seems to get stuck in the dips and I wake up in pain.

Nothing can replace your own personal testing, as you do have some specific health considerations. You’d obviously want to consider something that allows for enough surface comfort while sleeping upon your side and also assists with pressure point relief, while still overall being resilient enough and provide enough support while both sleeping and seated. Your knees waking up in dips may be due to the product being too soft overall on top or the foams being lower in density and not as durable as you require.

I am very nervous about this decision because I don’t think I’d get the trial period. I’m hoping you could offer any advice.

I can certainly help with "how" to choose. However, it's not possible to make specific suggestions or recommendations for a mattress or combinations of materials or components because the first "rule" of mattress shopping is to always remember that you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress and there are too many unknowns, variables, and personal preferences (especially with your back problems and Fibromyalgia) involved that are unique to each person to use a formula or for anyone to be able to predict or make a specific suggestion or recommendation about which mattress or combination of materials and components or which type of mattress would be the best "match" for you in terms of "comfort", firmness, or PPP or how a mattress will "feel" to you or compare to another mattress based on specs (either yours or a mattress), sleeping positions, health conditions, or "theory at a distance" that can possibly be more reliable than your own careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in step 4 of the tutorial) or your own personal sleeping experience (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here ).

While I already provided some links about what information to find about any mattress you might be considering, along with durability guidelines to rate those specifications, the next thing I’d recommend you review is the mattress shopping tutorial here which includes all the basic information, steps, and guidelines that can help you make the best possible choice for your mattress exchange.

Two of the most important links in the tutorial are post #2 here which has more about the different ways to choose a suitable mattress that is the best "match" for you in terms of "comfort", firmness, and PPP, and post #13 here which has more about the most important parts of the "value" of a mattress purchase which can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses in terms of suitability (how well you will sleep), durability (how long you will sleep well), and the overall value of a mattress based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.

I’ll be interested in learning about our next visit to your retailer, and any other information you’re able to find about any potential mattresses you’re considering.

Phoenix
07 Mar 2017 06:57
  • hersplash
  • hersplash's Avatar
Hi Phoenix. Love and have poured through your site. I bought a Prana Samadhi 4 Queen almost 5 years ago for my adjustable bed. It was fine in the beginning but developed deep impressions after only a few years. It has been unbearable for the last 2. The company determined it was defective after having significant bumps. I’ve read what you have written about this bed and the inferior layers they had, so I was not surprised. Oddly the significant bump they found is not where I sleep. Furthermore, I only weigh 100 pounds so it seems strange that I could make such an impact. However, a sales person said heavier people create less impressions because their weight is more distributed. Is that true?

I now have a credit of $4699 at the store. I do not need the base, just the mattress. I tried out and liked the Prana Super Vinyasa 5 Super Plush. That would be $4099. But I also liked the Tempur-pedic Flex Supreme Breeze Plush at $3799. I think, but am not sure, that the new Prana is a bit firmer that my current bed. I don’t recall trying out all the Tempur-pedics so I was going to go back and try the Countour Rhapsody Luxe, Countour Elite Breeze and Flex Supreme Breeze (no plush) just because they are higher price points. Also, I did really like the Serta Icomfort Savant 3 Plush but at $1774 but I would be leaving close to $3000 on the table. And no, they won’t let me buy 2 or 3. I asked!

I use the adjustable bed all day long with the back raised, so one of my concerns again is the impressions. Also, I often use a heating pad on my back, which I’ve heard is not good for the Tempur-pedic. I am a side sleeper, have many back problems and Fibromyalgia. Currently my knees seems to get stuck in the dips and I wake up in pain.

I am very nervous about this decision because I don’t think I’d get the trial period. I’m hoping you could offer any advice. Thank you in advance.
20 Feb 2017 12:38
  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
Hi CholeJo,

Welcome to the Mattress Forum! :)

Hi. We are down to 2 finalists, the Pranayama 5.2 Plush and Elevate Felicity Plush, at 2 different stores in our latex mattress search. We are pressed for time and would like a new bed this week. We are 110 and 175 lbs., not heavy people. Our old bed, a Serta Perfect Sleeper-(not!)-started sagging within months. We want a mattress that will last, with no sagging!

I’m sorry that you’ve had a problem with your old Serta mattress, but unfortunately many of the larger “S” brands do tend to use less durable materials in their construction, which can lead to premature and excessive sagging. I’ll do my best to provide comments upon the products you’re comparing.

I know from my search on Prana and reading past posts that you are not too keen on Prana value-wise, but I am wondering if perhaps they have improved? I would much appreciate any thoughts. Specs are below:

You’ve obviously been doing some searching on the forum regarding Prana. They did start using some better foams in their 5.0 line as compared to past lines, but I would still make some careful “value comparisons” regarding their products.

Pranayama 5.2 Plush/The sales rep states the latex is Talalay latex. The website and label reads:
• SKU: PRAN-60003
• Collection: Lotus
• Vendor: Pranasleep
• Mattress:75"L x 39"W x 11.5"H
• Foundations:75"L x 39"W x 6"H Mattress and Foundation dimensions are approximate
• Quilt: 100% Rayon Cover - Lotus flower design
FR Fibers
1" Soft poly foam 1.5LB
1" Soft poly foam 1.5LB
1/2" Firm poly foam 1.45LB
• Comfort Layers: 2" Pranasleep performance latex
• Support System: 6" Prestressed Everlast core 3.75LB
1" 1.45 density foam
• Mattress Type: Latex,Power Base Compatible
• Origin: Made in the U.S.A

The quilt layers use a bit more of lower density polyfoam than I would normally recommend, totaling 2.5” of 1.5 lb. or less polyfoam. The 2” of Talalay latex (content not listed) would be a high quality material. The polyfoam core at 3.5 lb. would be a good quality material. The base 1’ of polyfoam at 1.45 lb. is a lower density, but at only 1” at the bottom of the mattress wouldn’t necessarily be as much of a cause for concern as the upper quilt polyfoam.

Elevate Felicity Plush (made by Restonic) The website and label reads:
714412830
• Outlast Technology; Proactively manages body temperature.
• ComfortQuilt; High density for longer comfort life (The sales rep states the quilting contains 2" of Talalay.)
• Talalay LiftFoam; 2" 15 ILD. 2" 24 ILD Buoyant, weightless support & comfort
• TruComfort Core; 6" 27 ILD, Ecofriendly, pre-compressed for longer comfort
• Euro Platform; Fine tailored, enhanced support system.

Here I’m not quite as sure if they are providing the complete specifications. There is a total of 10” of material listed, but the specifications seem to indicate that there is some more foam in the quilt, and it isn’t as common for latex to be quilted to under the ticking. So my thought is that there might be some polyfoam quilted to the covering. The Talalay (blend not listed) in the 15 ILD and the 24 ILD would be good quality materials. You’d want to learn the density of the 6” polyfoam core, as the ILD doesn’t tell you much about the durability of that foam support core. If you’re able to clarify that this is a 10” mattress and it only has the three layers of foam (or if there is polyfoam in the quilt that you need to learn about) as well as the density of the 6” polyfoam core, I can make more complete comments about this mattress.

Phoenix
19 Feb 2017 18:32
  • ChloeJo
  • ChloeJo's Avatar
Hi. We are down to 2 finalists, the Pranayama 5.2 Plush and Elevate Felicity Plush, at 2 different stores in our latex mattress search. We are pressed for time and would like a new bed this week. We are 110 and 175 lbs., not heavy people. Our old bed, a Serta Perfect Sleeper-(not!)-started sagging within months. We want a mattress that will last, with no sagging!

The latex mattresses cost the same at $2199.00, and feel virtually the same comfort and support-wise.. (Prana is slightly more cushy.) I've spent about 1/2 hour on the Prana over the past 2 days., Probably 15 mins. on the Elevate. I'm just wondering about the components and which would be the better value. I know from my search on Prana and reading past posts that you are not too keen on Prana value-wise, but I am wondering if perhaps they have improved? I would much appreciate any thoughts. Specs are below:

Pranayama 5.2 Plush/The sales rep states the latex is Talalay latex. The website and label reads:
• SKU: PRAN-60003
• Collection: Lotus
• Vendor: Pranasleep
• Mattress:75"L x 39"W x 11.5"H
• Foundations:75"L x 39"W x 6"H Mattress and Foundation dimensions are approximate
• Quilt: 100% Rayon Cover - Lotus flower design
FR Fibers
1" Soft poly foam 1.5LB
1" Soft poly foam 1.5LB
1/2" Firm poly foam 1.45LB
• Comfort Layers: 2" Pranasleep performance latex
• Support System: 6" Prestressed Everlast core 3.75LB
1" 1.45 density foam
• Mattress Type: Latex,Power Base Compatible
• Origin: Made in the U.S.A.

Elevate Felicity Plush (made by Restonic) The website and label reads:
714412830
• Outlast Technology; Proactively manages body temperature.
• ComfortQuilt; High density for longer comfort life (The sales rep states the quilting contains 2" of Talalay.)
• Talalay LiftFoam; 2" 15 ILD. 2" 24 ILD Buoyant, weightless support & comfort
• TruComfort Core; 6" 27 ILD, Ecofriendly, pre-compressed for longer comfort
• Euro Platform; Fine tailored, enhanced support system.

Thank you in advance for any help!
15 Feb 2017 12:02
  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
Hi backtosleep,

We recently bought a Leesa mattress (king size) to replace our sagging, pillow-top queen-size mattress of 15 years. I want to love it but I have some issues: 1) There's a sort of "deadness" to it, and it's doing nothing to alleviate serious nighttime-only back pain. It doesn't seem to conform or mold to my body (I'm a back and side sleeper).

I’m sorry your Leesa mattress isn’t working out for you currently, but at least you did have the foresight to choose a product that has a good return policy should things continue to not work out for you as well as you would hope. The Leesa has 2” of Avena 3.65 lb. polyfoam and 2” of 3.0 lb. memory foam on top of a 6” 1.8 lb. polyfoam core. It’s possible that this may not be the preferred componentry, in thick enough quantities, or substantial enough in the comfort layers for your personal preference. And unfortunately, there is no one type of mattress guaranteed to alleviate back pain – I wish there was! ;) This would be specific of course to each individual.

the Leesa apparently requires a platform bed or frame, which is not my preferred style (was hoping for a simple upholstered headboard and frame - no footboard - with some underbed storage).

The Leesa, like most modern mattresses, only needs to be placed upon a firm and flat surface, and a platform bed would be one surface that generally would suffice. There’s more about appropriate foundations for most modern mattresses in the foundation thread here .

I decided to test drive some mattresses in-store. A local City Mattress had several I immediately felt much more comfortable on: a Pranayama 5.2, a Moon Plush, a Moon Super Plush and a Sequoia. The salesman told me the Prana mattress has more natural, talalay latex, while my Leesa has synthetic, Dunlop latex, and that that might be what is causing my discomfort. He described the mattresses I tried as having "more loft."

Unfortunately, there are no meaningful specifications listed on the City Mattress web site, or the pranasleep site, for me to make any meaningful comments about the karma moon plush or moon super plush. Both use a pocketed spring unit along with poly foam, but no layerings or densities are provided. There is also no meaningful information about the City Mattress Sequoia Plush on the City Mattress site, so you’d have to contact them for the exact specifications and information listed here (I also linked to this in my reply to one of your posts previously). Once you would have that information about any of these mattresses you could then compare that information to the durability guidelines here .

There is no latex in the Leesa mattress (see the specifications in post #2 here ), and there’s no listing of any latex in the three mattresses you mentioned from City Mattress. This is why it’s so important to deal with retailers who are knowledgeable about their products and to acquire complete specifications.

I've now read that the Prana (and perhaps similar latex mattresses?) can sag

Again, the pranasleep mattresses you mentioned were not latex mattresses. Latex in general will be one of the most durable foam mattress material you can find, and it will show very little loss in compression modulus (support factor) over time.

I don't want to get "trapped" by the store's return policy into shopping there again.

The mattresses found at City Mattress are mostly the types of brands I usually advise to avoid, as they tend to be less transparent about their materials and tend to use lower quality foams (see the guidelines here along with post #3 here and post #12 here and post #404 here ). And the few brands that they offer that do tend to use better materials are in a higher price range and I would make some careful “value comparisons” before considering purchasing those items.

Is there another mattress like the Prana that perhaps costs less, or at least a store that has a more fair return/repair policy?

First, in case you haven’t found this already, some of the options or possibilities I'm aware of in and around the Rochester area (subject to making sure that any mattress you are considering meets the quality/value guidelines here ) are listed in post #11 here .

There is more information in post #9 here about the different ways that one mattress can "match" or "approximate" another one. Every layer and component in a mattress (including the cover and any quilting materials) will affect the feel and performance of every other layer and component and the mattress "as a whole" so unless you are able to find another mattress that uses exactly the same type of materials, components, cover and quilting, layer thicknesses, layer firmnesses, and overall design (which would be fairly unlikely) then there really isn't a reliable way to match one mattress to another one in terms of "comfort", firmness, and PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your Personal preferences) based on the specifications of the mattresses (even assuming that you can find out all the specifications you would need for both mattresses you are comparing in the first place).

Mattress manufacturers generally try to differentiate their mattress from the mattresses made by other manufacturers and don't normally try to "match" another mattress that is made by a different manufacturer so unless a manufacturer specifically says in their description of a mattress that one of their mattresses in the same general category is specifically designed to "match" or "approximate" another one in terms of firmness or "feel" and PPP and/or they are very familiar with both mattresses and can provide reliable guidance about how they compare based on the "averages" of a larger group of people that have compared them (different people may have very different opinions about how two mattresses compare) ... the only reliable way to know for certain how two mattresses would compare for you in terms of how they "feel" or in terms of firmness or PPP (regardless of anyone else's opinions of how they compare which may be different from your own) would be based on your own careful testing or actual sleeping experience on both of them.

There are also no "standard" definitions or consensus of opinions for firmness ratings and different manufacturers can rate their mattresses very differently than others so a mattress that one manufacturer rates as being a specific firmness could be rated very differently by another manufacturer. Different people can also have very different perceptions of firmness and softness compared to others as well and a mattress that feels firm for one person can feel like "medium" for someone else or even "soft" for someone else (or vice versa) depending on their body type, sleeping style, physiology, their frame of reference based on what they are used to, and their individual sensitivity and perceptions. There are also different types of firmness and softness that different people may be sensitive to that can affect how they "rate" a mattress as well (see post #15 here ) so different people can also have very different opinions on how two mattresses compare in terms of firmness and some people may rate one mattress as being firmer than another and someone else may rate them the other way around. This is all relative and very subjective and is as much an art as a science.

In other words ... the short version of all of this and the "bottom line" is that spending time testing “brand name” mattresses or any mattress where you can't find out the specifics of the materials and components inside it is mostly wasted because it would be too risky to purchase and it can't be used as a reference point to purchase another mattress that is "similar".

My husband is very intrigued by the online mattress suppliers - now he's interested in the Helix. I don't want to be shopping for a mattress indefinitely, though!

I’d first refer you back to my reply to your earlier post and follow the steps outlines in the mattress shopping tutorial and the links I previously provided.

If you wish to look online, you can use the experience and expertise of the members listed in post #21 here who are all very experienced and knowledgeable and specialize in providing the type of help and guidance on the phone that can help you make good choices. There are a wide range of latex and memory foam and other options included in the choices there and I believe that all of them compete well with the best in the industry in terms of their quality, value, service, and transparency.

Their detailed knowledge of their mattresses and how they fit with different body types and sleeping positions along with your feedback from local testing, a customer base of many people that they can use as reference points, and any exchange, return, or any options they have available to customize a mattress after a purchase can help lower the risk of an online purchase. These online retailers or manufacturers can also be a good "value reference" for local purchases to make sure that if you are paying a "premium" for a local purchase (in exchange for the kind of "in person" guidance, service, and value that comes with dealing with a local retailer that can help you make more "accurate" choices that you have tested in person) is not too high. They can also inform you of any potential return/exchange polices that they may offer just in case your purchase doesn’t turn out as well as you had hoped.

Phoenix
15 Feb 2017 05:19
  • backtosleep
  • backtosleep's Avatar
We recently bought a Leesa mattress (king size) to replace our sagging, pillow-top queen-size mattress of 15 years. I want to love it but I have some issues: 1) There's a sort of "deadness" to it, and it's doing nothing to alleviate serious nighttime-only back pain. It doesn't seem to conform or mold to my body (I'm a back and side sleeper). And 2) the Leesa apparently requires a platform bed or frame, which is not my preferred style (was hoping for a simple upholstered headboard and frame - no footboard - with some underbed storage).

I decided to test drive some mattresses in-store. A local City Mattress had several I immediately felt much more comfortable on: a Pranayama 5.2, a Moon Plush, a Moon Super Plush and a Sequoia. The salesman told me the Prana mattress has more natural, talalay latex, while my Leesa has synthetic, Dunlop latex, and that that might be what is causing my discomfort. He described the mattresses I tried as having "more loft."

I've now read that the Prana (and perhaps similar latex mattresses?) can sag, and I don't want to get "trapped" by the store's return policy into shopping there again. Is there another mattress like the Prana that perhaps costs less, or at least a store that has a more fair return/repair policy? My husband is very intrigued by the online mattress suppliers - now he's interested in the Helix. I don't want to be shopping for a mattress indefinitely, though!

Thank you so much for your suggestions,

Back to sleep in Rochester
14 Feb 2017 15:16
  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
Hi backtosleep,

Welcome to the Mattress Forum! :)

I don’t know that Rochester will reply, as this thread is over five years old, but I’ll try to help a little with selecting a mattress in the Rochester area.

First, in case you haven’t found this already, some of the options or possibilities I'm aware of in and around the Rochester area (subject to making sure that any mattress you are considering meets the quality/value guidelines here ) are listed in post #11 here .

As for guidance on how to select a mattress, the first place to start your research is the mattress shopping tutorial here which includes all the basic information, steps, and guidelines that can help you make the best possible choice ... and perhaps more importantly know how and why to avoid the worst ones.

Two of the most important links in the tutorial are post #2 here which has more about the different ways to choose a suitable mattress (either locally or online) that is the best "match" for you in terms of "comfort", firmness, and PPP that can help you assess and minimize the risks of making a choice that doesn't turn out as well as you hoped for, and post #13 here which has more about the most important parts of the "value" of a mattress purchase which can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses in terms of suitability (how well you will sleep), durability (how long you will sleep well), and the overall value of a mattress compared to your other finalists based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you (including the price of course and the options you have available after a purchase if your choice doesn't turn out as well as you hoped for).

Outside of PPP (which is the most important part of "value"), the next most important part of the value of a mattress purchase is durability which is all about how long you will sleep well on a mattress. This is the part of your research that you can't see or "feel" and assessing the durability and useful life of a mattress depends on knowing the specifics of its construction and the type and quality of the materials inside it regardless of the name of the manufacturer on the label or how a mattress feels in a showroom or when it is relatively new so I would always make sure that you find out the information listed here so you can compare the quality of the materials and components to the durability guidelines here to make sure there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress that would be a cause for concern relative to the durability and useful life of a mattress before making any purchase.

Outside of that, if you have other more specific questions, I’ll be happy to do my best to answer them for you.

Phoenix
14 Feb 2017 14:14
  • backtosleep
  • backtosleep's Avatar
Hi, Rochester,
We're also in Rochester, also suffering from back pain, and also found the Prana mattress to be comfortable in the store. Luckily, I found your comments before making any purchases. What did you end up with, and are you happy with it??
Many thanks,
Backtosleep
10 Feb 2017 15:56
  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
Hi Thaddeus,

Thank you so much for your response! You convinced me to do some more research (all on this site

You’re welcome! And I’m happy that I inspired you to do some extra research – that’s the goal!

I came across some information on this site pertaining to Gardner Mattresses. I went to their store in Salem, MA and tried out a couple of their beds. Their general manager was very helpful and knowledgeable - and I appreciate their no frills/no gimmick approach. Their mattresses are hand-made and seem to be of pretty high quality. I was curious as to your opinion of them and in particular - if you have familiarity with two mattresses that really stuck out to me and of which I'm considering purchasing

Gardner Mattress is a member of this site which means that I think very highly of them and that I believe that they compete well with the best in the industry in terms of their quality, value, service, knowledge, and transparency. I certainly wouldn't hesitate to purchase a mattress from them.

(1) Nature Firm Wool

I don’t see a listing for this item on their web site, but I’m assuming it’s a version of their Nature’s Soft mattress, just with a different amount of wool being added, or perhaps an increase in the number/tightness of the tufting. This product would use higher quality materials.

Wool is a great material that is a strong preference for some people and there are certainly some good benefits to sleeping on wool. It will be different and firmer than sleeping on a soft foam material (and it will also get a little firmer as it compresses over time). An "old fashioned" two sided tufted innerspring mattress with natural fiber comfort layers would certainly be a very durable choice but it will also tend to be firmer than most mattresses that use foam materials in the comfort layers and natural fibers will tend to become firmer over time as they compress and pack down to some degree while foam layers will tend to become softer (particularly under the heavier parts of the body) over time. Some of the comments in post #4 here and post #2 here may be worth reading as well.

(2) Visco Pocket Coil (hybrid memory foam)

The complete specifications are not listed on their web site for this item, and there are variations that can be had. It does list the memory foam as 4 lb, which meets the minimum I would recommend for a two-sided product. This certainly would have a different feel from an all-wool mattress.

Aside from the basic comments I’ve added here, your best resource for comparisons of durability to help manage your performance expectations would be a more detailed conversation with Gardner. And of course, your own personal testing! While I can’t comment completely about the Visco Pocket Coil until I know all of the layers inside, it appears as if you’re certainly considering items of a high quality.

I’ll be interested to learn of any decisions you make or future questions,

Phoenix
10 Feb 2017 11:24
  • Thaddeus
  • Thaddeus's Avatar
Phoenix -

Thank you so much for your response! You convinced me to do some more research (all on this site) - and I actually came to understand more about mattresses and why the Simmons is really not a good option - but I am still considering the Prana because of the higher quality materials used. However - being that I'm in New Hampshire - I came across some information on this site pertaining to Gardner Mattresses. I went to their store in Salem, MA and tried out a couple of their beds. Their general manager was very helpful and knowledgeable - and I appreciate their no frills/no gimmick approach. Their mattresses are hand-made and seem to be of pretty high quality. I was curious as to your opinion of them and in particular - if you have familiarity with two mattresses that really stuck out to me and of which I'm considering purchasing:

(1) Nature Firm Wool
(2) Visco Pocket Coil (hybrid memory foam)

Both felt great and I really like the way they feel - and seem to be built with materials that will ensure relative durability.

Thanks again for your invaluable insight!
09 Feb 2017 15:24
  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
Hi Thaddeus,

Welcome to the Mattress Forum! :)

I have spent a lot of time on this forum absorbing the wisdom here and am very appreciative of the knowledge. I also am somebody who doesn't want to spend hours on research - but still want to make an informed decision. I am on the fence between these two mattresses (I have tested them both personally and they pass the "feel" PPP test) - but I'm curious as to your expertise and analysis based on the specifications of these mattresses, which are noted below

Unfortunately, making an informed decision without doing a bit of research isn’t really possible, but it doesn’t need to be hours and hours. Start by reading the mattress shopping tutorial here . In its simplest form ... choosing the "best possible" mattress for any particular person really comes down to FIRST finding a few knowledgeable and transparent retailers and/or manufacturers (either locally or online) that sell the types of mattresses that you are most interested in that are in a budget range you are comfortable with and that you have confirmed will provide you with the all the information you need about the materials and components inside the mattresses they sell so you will be able to make informed choices and meaningful comparisons between mattresses and then ...

1. Careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in the tutorial) to make sure that a mattress is a good match for you in terms of "comfort", firmness, and PPP ... and/or that you are comfortable with the options you have available to return, exchange, or "fine tune" the mattress and any costs involved if you can't test a mattress in person or aren't confident that your mattress is a suitable choice.

2. Checking to make sure that there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress you are considering relative to your weight/BMI range that could compromise the durability and useful life of the mattress (see the durability guidelines here ).

3. Comparing your finalists for "value" based on #1 and #2 and all the other parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.

Regarding the Simmons Beautryrest NIghttime Galaxy Ultimate Plush, if you refer to the foam quality/density guidelines here you will see that they are all either low or very low quality materials, and having 6" of low or very low quality/density materials in the upper layers any mattress would be an obvious weak link in the mattress in terms of the durability and useful life of the mattress and would certainly be a good reason to avoid it.

As for the Pranasleep Moon Plush, the 2” of 1.5 lb polyfoam in the quilt would be a concern, being a little more than an inch or so that I recommend being within for lower density foams in the upper layers. The 3.75 lb. Everlast is a high quality polyfoam. The 1.45 lb polyfoam underneath the spring layer is a firm polyfoam and is also a lower density but this would be fine in a 1" layer on the bottom of a mattress and wouldn't affect durability. All the Pranasleep mattresses tend to be in a significantly higher budget range than other similar mattresses, and I would make sure you make some very careful value comparisons with this and other similar mattresses.

There is also more information about the 3 most important parts of "value" of a mattress purchase in post #13 here which can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses in terms of suitability (how well you will sleep), durability (how long you will sleep well), and the overall value of a mattress compared to your other finalists based on suitability, durability, and all the other parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you (including the price of course and the options you have available after a purchase if your choice doesn't turn out as well as you hoped for).

Phoenix
09 Feb 2017 14:26
  • Thaddeus
  • Thaddeus's Avatar
I have spent a lot of time on this forum absorbing the wisdom here and am very appreciative of the knowledge. I also am somebody who doesn't want to spend hours on research - but still want to make an informed decision. I am on the fence between these two mattresses (I have tested them both personally and they pass the "feel" PPP test) - but I'm curious as to your expertise and analysis based on the specifications of these mattresses, which are noted below. I tested these both at Jordan's Furniture in MA and the sleep technician was knowledgeable and able to spell out the details of each mattress. His opinion is that the Beautyrest is "in another league" than the Prana - but I'd be curious as to if anyone here has a comparative analysis that they could share on the two contrasting mattress build/specifications. I'm most appreciative of any insight from you kind, knowledgeable experts. Thanks!

Name: Moon Plush
SKU: PRAN-60026
Mattress:75"L x 39"W x 10"H
Foundations:75"L x 39"W x 6"H
Mattress and Foundation dimensions are approximate
Quilt: 100% Polyester cover
FR Fibers
1" Soft HD Foam 1.5LB
1" Soft HD Foam 1.5LB
Comfort Layers: 1" Everlast foam - 3.75LB density
Support System: Individually Wrapped Coil Design
Patented Wall Wrap for Max Flex
15 Gauge steel with 13.75 gauge edge
Twice Tempered Steel
T/480 F/690 Q/832 K/1056
BOTTOM UPHOLSTERY (Below Innerspring)
1" density foam 1.45LB
Power Base Compatible
Mattress Type: Innerspring,Power Base Compatible

Name: Nighttime Galaxy Ultimate Plush
SKU: SIMM-80110
Mattress:75"L x 39"W x 13.5"H
Foundations:75"L x 39"W x 5.5"H
Mattress and Foundation dimensions are approximate
Quilt: Evenloft Stretch Knit Cover with
MyClimate Technology
FR Sock
Comfort Layers: 1" AirCool Max Diamond Memory foam 2.8
2" AirCool Memory Foam 3.5LB
1.5" AirCool Memory Foam 3.5LB
Bottom Upholstery (BELOW INNERSPRING)
1.5" Prestressed Energy foam 1.2LB
Support System: Single Sided Sleep Surface
Beautyrest Pocketed Coil
1000 Coil Density
T/594 F/825 Q/1000 K/1296 (Pre-edge)
T/450 F/660 Q/825 K/1089 (Actual)
15.5 Gauge Steel
Ventilated foam encasement
Power Base Compatible
Mattress Type: Hybrid Memory Foam,Innerspring,Power Base Compatible
31 Jan 2017 09:25
  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
Hi Gman52,

Thank you for the detailed information about your shopping experience. It sounds as if you’ve been busy!

City Mattress. Answered all my questions and if he didn't know the answer, was willing to look it up for me, even though some of his answers were incorrect. Such as, companies don’t make flipable mattresses anymore because the “foundations are different these days and the mattress are constructed of higher grade materials”.

Two-sided mattresses certainly are still made, as you are aware. It is true that these will typically benefit from a flexing torsion-modular or true coil box spring, as opposed to a foundation, but the two-sided mattresses didn’t disappear because of the rise of foundations within the industry. It was more an issue of cost than anything.

All their latex is a 55/45 natural/synthetic Talalay blend.

All of the blended Talalay latex you are likely to encounter (Talalay Global or Radium) would be 70/30 SBR/NR in the blend.

Their top of line latex (Prana) is extremely plushy and comes in various thicknesses (they all have a 6" latex support layer and their comfort layers get thicker as you move up the price scale).

Prana uses some higher quality materials in the mattresses, but I would make some careful value comparisons when considering their products, because as you discovered they are quite expensive products.

Sleep City. I couldn't even intelligently describe their latex mattress because no one came over to me, which lead me to believe that perhaps this is how their customer service would be after the sale.

Unfortunately sleep shops can be short staffed at times. Also, some know that people are tired of being “trampled” when they first enter a store, so they take the “hands-off” approach to the extreme. And sometimes you just have a staff who aren’t as attentive to their clients, so if I needed help I would simply seek out a sales associate. I wouldn’t necessarily use this as a complete reflection upon the overall service of a company. They do offer the Gold Bond latex mattresses using Vytex latex, which is a good quality and durable material.

Metro Mattress. Words can't even begin to describe the level of unprofessionalism I experienced while in there.

I’m sorry you had a bad experience with the salesperson there. I think your email to their customer service was a good idea, as I’m sure the ownership would want to know about your experience. In situations like this I try to avoid painting with too broad of a brush, but I certainly can understand some of your concerns with the questions asked.

Talalay mattress is the “best in the industry because they wash it more than any other Talalay manufactured product” (oh really???) and “we source all of our latex from the best place in the world…Italy”

If it’s the latex listed on their web site, Pure Talalay Bliss, this would be from Talalay Global in Connecticut. All latex is rinsed after production to remove residual soaps and proteins.

Through the years, I have determined that I am the exception to the rule when it comes to comparison shopping. Sales people in any industry and any store know instantly what kind of customer they are dealing with based on how you ask and answer questions.

As sad as it is ... most of the members that spends a few hours on this site will know more about mattresses and mattress materials than most of the salespeople that sell them in the mainstream industry and it's always refreshing to find a retailer or manufacturer such as Jamestown that is transparent and knowledgeable about the mattresses they sell and the materials they use inside them.

Jamestown Mattress. Jim Pullan (owner) emailed me back and was very accommodating with the price and the specs, he was professional, courteous and truly wanted to work with me and win our business. He succeeded.

As you might know from your reading here I think highly of Jamestown Mattress and the quality and value of their mattresses as well as their knowledge and customer service and willingness to do some "fine tuning" for their customers that need it.

I’m looking forward to your future updates.

Phoenix
30 Jan 2017 16:55
  • Gman52
  • Gman52's Avatar
All of the below stores I visited are in the suburb of Henrietta and I was only looking at latex mattresses.

Armed with my new information from this website I set out to find out what mattresses fit me the best, and more importantly what company would work with me and ultimately give me the best service.

The Good....City Mattress and Jamestown Mattress
1. JM...clear winner here, more to follow below
2. CM...very professional store and salesman. Answered all my questions and if he didn't know the answer, was willing to look it up for me, even though some of his answers were incorrect. Such as, companies don’t make flipable mattresses anymore because the “foundations are different these days and the mattress are constructed of higher grade materials”. Hmmmmm…. I let him slide because he was professional and treated me with the same respect.
All their latex is a 55/45 natural/synthetic Talalay blend. Their top of line latex (Prana) is extremely plushy and comes in various thicknesses (they all have a 6" latex support layer and their comfort layers get thicker as you move up the price scale). In addition they all have 3" of poly on top and it's advertised as "high density". I inquired to the pound rating of this poly and he didn't know, but was willing to look it up if I really wanted to know. Unfortunately these mattresses are extremely expensive and way out of my limits of spending....$6000 to $12000!!!

The Bad.....Sleep City
I couldn't even intelligently describe their latex mattress because no one came over to me, which lead me to believe that perhaps this is how their customer service would be after the sale. I was there for 15 minutes and read some of their literature, sat on their beds, laid down (seemed ok), read some more and no one acknowledged I was there. I saw their prices (way to high) and just got up and left. Not good in my opinion.

The Ugly.....very ugly.....Metro Mattress
Words can't even begin to describe the level of unprofessionalism I experienced while in there. These “salesmen”, and I use this term very loosely, were sophomoric, rude, ill-informed and uninformed about the product they were selling. They asked personal questions unrelated to mattresses and were obsessed about my wife (who wasn’t there). They berated me with questions about her (that I ignored) and at one point asked me "does your wife like it hard or soft", and he knew what he was implying because the other 2 morons giggled like 10-year-old boys. They spouted information about their latex that was told to them from their sales rep and NOT based on their own experiences or hands on knowledge. They used strong arm tactics whenever I questioned what they threw around as perceived truth to intimidate me and had no documentation to validate their claims, such as their Talalay mattress is the “best in the industry because they wash it more than any other Talalay manufactured product” (oh really???) and “we source all of our latex from the best place in the world…Italy” I don’t know if this is true, but I thought Sri Lanka was the epicenter of sourcing rubber. This all sounds too crazy I know, and I still can't believe it happened, but it is all true. I talked with a customer service agent on their website and informed them of what happened. I'm sure Metro Mattress is a fine company, but this one location has completely turned me off on any of their products. STAY AWAY FROM THIS PARTICULAR LOCATION!

Through the years, I have determined that I am the exception to the rule when it comes to comparison shopping. Sales people in any industry and any store know instantly what kind of customer they are dealing with based on how you ask and answer questions. They have a PHD in human behavior just from dealing with the general public. I’m going to go out on a limb and say that the majority of the general public is uninformed, does not comparison shop and they just want to slap money on the counter and walk out the door with a product, and I believe this is how this one particular Metro Mattress operates. Based on the fact that you are on this website I’m guessing you are the exception to the rule as well and you can arm yourself with invaluable mattress knowledge from here and flip the script on the mattress companies and find out which sales people and companies are worth YOUR time just by how they answer YOUR questions.

Now, back to the good....the very good....Jamestown Mattress.
Jamestown Mattress is the polar opposite of Metro Mattress. The salesman was polite, courteous, professional and answered all of my questions to the best of his ability. Although some of his answers were suspect too, such as when I inquired about their fire-retardant layer, he replied “I’m not sure what it is, it’s something they put in the mattresses”, but I let him slide because of his professionalism and how transparent they are with their materials on their website. All of their latex products are 100% natural latex with varying degrees of firmness and price. Their top of the line, Nature’s Cloud Euro Top, felt good, relieved pressure, gave support and was generally comfortable for the 5/10 minutes I laid on it, which is hardly enough time I know, but overall I was impressed with everything I had seen and witnessed about the company thus far and plus they are “local”. They are very forthright about their materials and are more than willing to show you and talk about those layers. I wanted to explore JM in more depth.

So, I decided to email their factory directly to see if I could open up a line of communication with them and work on the price and go over the basics of the mattress. Based on my local experiences I had determined that I was either going to purchase factory direct locally or on line, with a heavy lean toward local. Jim Pullan (owner) emailed me back and was very accommodating with the price and the specs, he was professional, courteous and truly wanted to work with me and win our business. He succeeded.

We hope to make a trip down to Jamestown and talk face to face with Jim in the near future to put a face with a name, talk over the specifics of our mattress and hopefully he can give some recommendations on firmness of the layers etc.
More to follow in the future…
06 Jan 2017 12:18
  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
Hi damonmcm70,

And just as a closing note, I'm considering replacing this with a Vi Spring entry level mattress.

Vi-Spring certainly makes some exceptionally high quality hand built and tufted mattresses that uses high quality materials and components (pocket coils and natural fibers) but as you probably know they are in a much more premium budget range than many other mattresses that also use natural materials. There is more about Vi Spring and other "ultra premium" mattresses in post #2 here and post #2 here and post #2 here may also be of interest as well but I would be very careful to differentiate how you feel "about" a Vi Spring and how you feel "on" a Vi Spring. There are certainly cases where a mattress in this budget range may be "worth it" for a particular person that isn't price sensitive and that has specific criteria that aren't available in lower budget ranges but this would be unusual and in general I would need a compelling reason that clearly indicated there was "enough" of a difference in "real life" compared to many other mattresses that may be just as suitable in terms of comfort and PPP, just as durable, and that are in much lower budget ranges to justify the higher cost.

With that being said… I should also mention that the most knowledgeable people I know and have talked with about "super premium" brands (including some who have worked at some of them or toured their factories) have always spoken highly of VI Spring and tend to rate them either among the best or often the best of the super premium fiber/innerspring brands.

Phoenix
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