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Searched for: prana
14 Feb 2018 12:55
  • halaluya
  • halaluya's Avatar
Hi Phoenix and TMU - Thanks for the great info as always. I didn't get the White Lotus mattress, but still have the same unfortunate situation of owning a mattress that is too soft for me. (I would start a new topic but can't find a way to do that on the forum??)

The mattress I own is a PranaSleep Organic. The good news is I got a great deal on it - it was a floor model at an Urban Mattress store in Denver. Paid cash and rolled it into my Prius. They told me it was a bit of a prototype for them. The label just says Super Plush (queen size) - doesn't seem exactly like any of the models on their current website. But I believe it is all Talalay and 10" thick.

I know many of your recommended companies are able to exchange layers. I will contact Prana and find out if they can do that. But from what I've read here, I believe I would be happier with Dunlop, which they don't seem to carry.

I'm 6'0", only 150 lbs, side sleeper. So its surprising that when I lay on my side I feel like my hips sink in too much, putting my spine in a curve that I don't like (I have mild scoliosis so need to pay attention to lower back issues.) Laying on my back is comfortable but I can't sleep that way.

If Prana writes back and say they could replace some layers and make it firmer, I'm still wondering if I'll like it. The mattress seems so bouncy. It will need to have a lot more support. So wondering about other options.

Do you know if any companies you work with would consider having me ship them my mattress and modifying it with layers that are more suitable? There is no zipper or any obvious way to get into the mattress, but there must be a way to open it up and replace layers! The outside material and wool topper is quite nice. I like to reuse and recycle rather than buying new when I can!

Or could someone ship me some Dunlop layers and perhaps I could find someone locally to do the job? I'm in western Colorado but have heard there are a couple of companies that make latex beds in Boulder/Denver.

Of course by the time I pay for this I might be able to just buy what I want new and sell the one I have. Maybe I just have to accept the fact that I bought this at the end of a long day of shopping (so it felt great) and made a quick decision based on it being a good deal and wanting to be done with the search! I guess I could try to sell it - do you have a forum for selling used latex mattresses?

Thanks so much!
03 Feb 2018 10:12
  • MattressToGo
  • MattressToGo's Avatar
Good luck making your decision!
02 Feb 2018 17:01
  • les_garten
  • les_garten's Avatar
Absolutely, I would be looking at it with a skeptical eye.
02 Feb 2018 16:50
  • MattressToGo
  • MattressToGo's Avatar
Many mattress manufacturers are less than complete with their specifications, often by design, other times just through differences in verbiage to make similar things sound special, and sometimes just through a lack of attention to detail/accuracy. Regardless, the Talalay in question would be a good quality material. You can always contact PranaSleep directly if you really want to know and see if they'll provide you that information. Personally, I'd have more concerns about what has been absorbed into the cell structure and ticking of a used mattress (guest room or not, a mattress is a passive air filtration unit) than the blend of Talalay used.
02 Feb 2018 16:37
  • les_garten
  • les_garten's Avatar
Their ad material is somewhat deceiving. I figured that out by Comparing the Nidra verbage to the OM Shanti, where they unequivocally state 100 % Natural Talalay, and Not a "propriety" mix.
02 Feb 2018 15:39
  • MattressToGo
  • MattressToGo's Avatar
They speak about their latex using "triple the natural rubber as ordinary Talalay latex", which when compared to a typical 70/30 blended Talalay would lead me to believe they are using the natural version of Talalay. Either way, it would be a good quality material, blended or natural.
02 Feb 2018 15:14
  • les_garten
  • les_garten's Avatar
Hi Jeff,
Thanx for the quick reply! The price could be as low as $500-$1000. I think it is a version 5, I am trying to confirm that. It would come with the Euro Foundation. The Talalay they use in that series seems to be blended Latex, should that concern me?

He says it has not been used because it was in his guest bedroom. No stains and Mint condition. It seems that I could always harvest the Latex later for a Build at that price maybe. If the latex was any good.

Most of the Complaints I've seen were for the Vayahsa
02 Feb 2018 14:36
  • MattressToGo
  • MattressToGo's Avatar
I'm not Phoenix, but I can help answer some of your questions.

The Nidra uses a 6" Talalay latex core, with additional Talalay latex on top of that. There is also 3" of polyurethane foam in the quilt panel. In the past the densities of the polyurethane quilt foams have been listed from 1.5 to 2.5 lb for their line, but I'm not sure of the exact densities of each layer in the mattress you mentioned (it's been discussed previously here on the site). There has also been some discussion previously on the site regarding some impressions in the quilt foam and excessive softening, but I don't think anything directly related to this model, and of course everyone's results can vary. My concern would be more the durability (density) of the polyurethane foam.

The other issue you'd have, which would be personal, would be your own comfort sleeping upon someone else's used mattress, and all that entails, versus the price you're getting. That's one area I can't offer much help.

Jeff Scheuer, The Beducator
Beducation / Mattress To Go
02 Feb 2018 13:37
  • les_garten
  • les_garten's Avatar
Hello Phoenix,
I could not figure out how to start a new topic so decided to ask you here.

I have an opportunity to buy a Like New Pranasleep Nidra for a great price.

It is supposed to be Mint condition from a guest bedroom and not used much.

Are there any issues with this model of pranasleep? Is it all Latex?
17 Jan 2018 13:51
  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
Hi jezz.

Welcome to our Mattress Forum! :)

Thank you for your appreciation.
Quite a bit of information and challenging questions – perfect for TMU!

I've been looking for a new mattress because my Simmons St. Anthony Luxury Firm (a Jordan's Furniture entry-level mattress from 2013) has degraded to the point that it's no longer supportive or comfortable.


I am sorry to hear that your 2014 Simmons mattress does not serve you any longer and although I don’t know if this was an “entry” level product you’ll generally get only 4-5 years from brands that use lower quality materials in their componentry. Many manufacturers make a wide range of mattresses that can vary from lower quality and less durable materials to higher quality and more durable materials in a wide range of prices.

The major brands such as Sealy/Stearns & Foster, Simmons, and Serta all tend to use lower quality and less durable materials in their mattresses than most of their smaller competitors that will tend to soften or break down prematurely relative to the price you pay which is why I would generally suggest avoiding all of them completely (along with the major retailers that focus on them as well) regardless of how they may feel in a showroom along with any mattress where you aren't able to find out the type and quality/durability of the materials inside it (see the guidelines here . along with post #3 here . and post #12 here . and post #404 here .).

I tried a PranaSleep Super Vinyasa Luxury Firm at a Jordan's near me and was delighted by the feel in the store. It had the right balance of pillow topper and underlying firmness that I was looking for. However I had objections to buying one, now 5 years wiser and burned once before.


PranaSleep is basically a latex mattress with a polyfoam quilt panel that uses proprietary foams and has better quality and materials than your previous Simmons mattress. The 2.5 lb quilt-able polyfoam is very high density (unique to quilt layers) The high density foam in the comfort layers is very good quality (giving overtime only a minimal loss of height i.e. body impressions), has a non-woven material “wrap” around the foam layers as well as exceptional initial comfort with no weak links.

I did not know how the quilting layer would hold up; it isn't clear what sort of polyfoam they're using in the assembly. Jordan's website lists some layers of soft 2.5LB polyfoam and the cross-section of an apparently related mattress (maybe a Wahe?) at Gardner's Mattress doesn't suggest anything particularly resilient to me.


As mentioned before the 2.5 lb poly would be a good quality and durable material and there aren’t generally any materials for a cause of concern quality-wise per what is listed by Jordan’s. If ever in doubt
You always want to make sure that you find out the information listed here so you can compare the quality of the materials and components to the durability guidelines here to make sure there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress that would be a cause for concern relative to the durability and useful life of a mattress before making any purchase.

Resiliency isn’t durability, but an indicator of surface “springiness” or elasticity. More resilient is more buoyant feeling, The material listed are in actuality better quality and you can read about materials and components that are all high quality materials that are very unlikely to reduce the durability or useful life of a mattress in the the durability guidelines mentioned above t

I was highly biased to prefer it because the mattress was in a sequestered room with other "natural-only" mattresses; the room was considerably quieter than the main showroom and thus more comfortable to me.


Having a quiet room can help someone relax and be less self-conscious trying out a product, but the comfort of the mattress is the same regardless of where it is placed in a showroom.

I haven't found any off-the-shelf products or mattresses that match what I'm looking for. My current thinking is that I'll assemble a medium-firm mattress matching the PranaSleep Super Vinyasa, which has its construction approximately described on Jordan's website: 1" medium latex, 2" medium-firm latex, and a 6" latex core, I'm assuming respectively ~24ILD, ~30ILD, and ~38ILD given the 100% Talalay vendors products. Then I need to find some separate pillow topper component for the mattress.


It is unlikely that you will be finding any off the shelf products that match exactly the feel of Parana. From your description and excitement it appears that you are considering not just a DIY latex mattress design, but one in which you design/engineer it yourself. Although this can be a lot of fun it entails a lot of trial and error as you would need to gather a great deal of experience in the process. If you are attracted to the idea of designing and building your own DIY mattress out of separate components that are purchased from one or several different sources then the first place I would start is by reading option 3 in post #15 here and the posts it links to (and option #1 and #2 as well) so that you have more realistic expectations and that you are comfortable with the learning curve, uncertainty, trial and error, or in some cases the higher costs that may be involved in the DIY process. It is also very doubtful that you will be able to exactly replicate the feel of Prana.

I would strongly suggest avoiding the temptation of trying to design your own mattress based on specs (either yours or a mattress) and instead work closely with the retailers and manufacturers that are of interest to you and use careful testing and feedback from your own body along with the expertise each of them has about their own mattresses to help you make your best choices. Your body doesn't understand specs ... only what I call PPP (Pressure relief, Posture and alignment, and Personal preferences)
You would be better off talking with a knowledgeable retailer or manufacturer and while you are clearly free to pursue this, you may want to check with some of TMU’s Trusted Members who are very experienced in latex, such as:
For Latex or All Latex sytems
For Innerspring Hybrids
For Poly Memory Foam combos

The best option I've come across so far looks to be the "Diamond Quilted Mattress Cover" from Foam Order, which is replaceable but is partly latex. I've also considered using a 2" or 3" wool topper. I'm curious if there are any other good topper or cover options out there, or if perhaps anyone has experience with the aforementioned mattress cover? Or perhaps I've been going the wrong direction, and there are latex comfort layers that aren't going to float me?


The Diamond Quilted Mattress Cover you cite is a mattress encasement using 2” of polyester fiber and 1” of latex quilted.
(very different than 1-2” of 2.5 lb polyfoam that you seem to like)
A 2” or 3” wool topper will also produce a comfortable, but different feel than your experience with PranaSleep. There is more information about choosing a topper in post #2 here and the topper guidelines it links to, which along with a conversation with a reliable and knowledgeable supplier (that can provide you with good information about how their toppers compare to each other or to other toppers they are familiar with that are available on the market), can help you use your sleeping experience as a reference point and guideline to help you choose the type, thickness, and firmness for a topper that has the least possible risk and the best chance for success.

While it can certainly be a rewarding project ... the best approach to a DIY mattress is a "spirit of adventure" where what you learn and the satisfaction that comes from the process itself is more important than any cost savings you may realize (which may or may not happen).

I hope this gives you enough information to help you narrow down your options.
Feel free to reach out.

Phoenix
13 Jan 2018 15:44
  • jezz
  • jezz's Avatar
As this is my first post, it must start with a huge "thank you" to Phoenix for operating and moderating this forum. Without this forum, mattress buying would be a considerably more opaque and challenging process.

To avoid the XY problem, some context first: I've been looking for a new mattress because my Simmons St. Anthony Luxury Firm (a Jordan's Furniture entry-level mattress from 2013) has degraded to the point that it's no longer supportive or comfortable. While searching for a new mattress, I tried a PranaSleep Super Vinyasa Luxury Firm at a Jordan's near me and was delighted by the feel in the store. It had the right balance of pillow topper and underlying firmness that I was looking for. However I had objections to buying one, now 5 years wiser and burned once before.
  1. I did not know how the quilting layer would hold up; it isn't clear what sort of polyfoam they're using in the assembly. Jordan's website lists some layers of soft 2.5LB polyfoam and the cross-section of an apparently related mattress (maybe a Wahe?) at Gardner's Mattress doesn't suggest anything particularly resilient to me.
  2. The lack of a competitive return policy at Jordan's (one-time exchange only) made the high price of the mattress unacceptable given my concerns over the longevity of the quilting.
  3. I was highly biased to prefer it because the mattress was in a sequestered room with other "natural-only" mattresses; the room was considerably quieter than the main showroom and thus more comfortable to me.
But I really fell in love with the feel of the mattress. I'm totally sold on latex in mattresses; I'd never encountered it as a mattress material before. In searching for a mattress that would approximately replicate it but with less risk, I've realized a few things. For one, I find it very valuable to be able to repair or change mattresses easily (e.g. cases with zippers); it hadn't occurred to me this was an option. I'm a lot more willing to accept the risk of not returning or exchanging a full mattress if I can change parts of it. For two, I don't think I like laying on straight latex; I like some sort of other quilting or comfort layer like polyfoam or wool batting. The straight latex I've laid on always "floats" me too much, even when my lumbar and shoulders feel appropriately supported. Lastly, I'm kind of annoyed by the Jordan's showroom.

I haven't found any off-the-shelf products or mattresses that match what I'm looking for. My current thinking is that I'll assemble a medium-firm mattress matching the PranaSleep Super Vinyasa, which has its construction approximately described on Jordan's website: 1" medium latex, 2" medium-firm latex, and a 6" latex core, I'm assuming respectively ~24ILD, ~30ILD, and ~38ILD given the 100% Talalay vendors products. Then I need to find some separate pillow topper component for the mattress.

The best option I've come across so far looks to be the "Diamond Quilted Mattress Cover" from Foam Order, which is replaceable but is partly latex. I've also considered using a 2" or 3" wool topper. I'm curious if there are any other good topper or cover options out there, or if perhaps anyone has experience with the aforementioned mattress cover? Or perhaps I've been going the wrong direction, and there are latex comfort layers that aren't going to float me?
31 Dec 2017 19:23
  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
Hi eroen.

I am glad you found it. Sometimes the search bar at the top gives more results, including from the site articles. Such as: this Prana search here

Happy New Year and if you have more specific questions I or any of the Expert Members (that are fully set up to answer) will be happy to assist you.

Phoenix
30 Dec 2017 14:31
  • eoren
  • eoren's Avatar
Hi Phoenix

I just found a post of yours regarding the top layer of Prana mattresses (oddly, I hadn't found it when searching for 'prana' but only did when searching 'hd foam').

I now realize this mattress would like have disappointed us quickly and am now looking at a drive to Worleys in MA.

Thanks
30 Dec 2017 14:18
  • eoren
  • eoren's Avatar
We visited Jordans Furniture today to try out mattresses and my wife and I both really liked the Pranasleep Karma Sky Super Plush. It seemed to offer a nice combination of softness and support.

From the tag, it has the following
Quilt:
100% Polyester Cover
FR Fibers
3/4" Super Soft HD Foam 2.5lb
2" Soft HD Foam 1.5lb

Comfort Layers:
2" Soft PranaSleep Performance Latex
1" Everlas Foam 3.75lb density

Support System:
Individually wrapped Coil Design
Patended wall wrap for max flex
15 gauge steel with 13.75 gauge edge
Twice tempered steel
T/480 F/690 Q/832 K/1056
Bottom Upholstery (below innerspring)
1" density foam 1.45lb

Foundation:
Solid wood slat foundation in 6" or 10" heights

King set is $3499

Greatly appreciate your thoughts on this mattress based on specs. I'm having a very hard time finding reviews anywhere on this brand and the Karma line in particular.

Thanks!
17 Dec 2017 18:19
  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
Hi selder,

Welcome to the Mattress Forum! :)

Help. I am in terrible pain. I bought a "Prana Sleep Karma Sky Luxury Firm" at City Mattress. It supports me well, but after only 2-3 hours, my body actually hurts from the warmth. The whole mattress becomes warm to the touch. I have MS and the warmth makes me feel very sick. I was told there is no memory foam in it, and it would be cool. I was told in City Mattress that it is Talalay latex . The store said it " features a comfort layer of Everlast™ 400 and CertiPUR foams along with layers of PranaSleep Performance Talalay latex" . A salesman in another store looked up the stats and told me it's 11" of layers contain the following: 2" quilt layer,1"soft HD polyfoam, 1" Firm HD polyfoam, and the Comfort layer contains: 1" latex , and 1" 4 lb density Everlast cooling layer. So the latex is deep within the mattress.


I’m sorry to hear about your pain and how sleeping warmer negatively impacts your MS. :(

The specifications I have on hand for the PranaSleep Karma Sky Luxury Firm are as follows.
Quilt Panel:
FR layer
1” plush 1.5 lb polyfoam
1” firm 1.5 lb polyfoam
Comfort layers:
1” Talalay latex
1” 4lb Everlast polyfoam
Support Core:
Pocketed coil spring unit with thicker gauge edge (15 vs. 13.75)
1” 1.45 base polyfoam

The mattress was represented to me as one that does not get hot.


The sleeping microclimate depends of course upon the entirety of the materials within the mattress, with the layers closest to your skin having the most dramatic impact. Additionally, all foams are insulators to a degree, and the more you sink into a mattress, the more potential there is for you to be more insulated and have less of your surface area exposed for heat exchange, and to sleep warmer.

The salesman in other store, thought it odd that the latex was buried so deep. I was told in City Mattress that the mattress was talalay latex and did not generate the heat.


I’m not sure why the salesman would be surprised with the location of the latex within the mattress, as designers will locate foams in in various regions within a mattress to achieve certain levels of comfort. This mattress uses a quilt panel with polyfoam in it (while there is quiltable latex it isn’t commonly used), and the latex is used just beneath that for a durable comfort/transition layer, which is quite common in innerspring mattresses. It all depends upon the comfort the designer is attempting to achieve with a particular model.

Foams themselves don’t “generate” heat (some are better at distributing your heat and retaining less heat), and Talalay latex tends to be the most breathable of all the common foams used within a mattress. But as I mentioned earlier, your mattress microclimate depends upon a number of things.

I have tried a gel pad, a cotten pad, and 2 wool blankets all covering the mattress. Sometimes all of these together. Nothing works.


Post #2 here speaks in a bit more detail about different sheet and protector materials that can assist with cooler sleep, as well as the effectiveness fo phase change materials used in some mattress pads and sheets. Natural fibers tend to work better for a mattress pad material. A thin wool pad might be able to assist a bit with being more “temperature neutral”, and it might also assist with having you sink in less into the mattress, which can also assist with sleeping warmer. Viscose can also be a good choice.

Is there any product with which I can block the heat.?


The heat is coming from your body, not the mattress, so the goal would be to find something that distributes your heat as best possible. If the mattress allows you to sink in too deeply and insulates you too much, there will be a limit to what a mattress pad and fitted sheets can do. If the suggestions in the links I’ve provided don’t work for you, there is a type of mattress pad that circulates water and does tend to provide relief to those with very specific heat issues. It’s called the chilipad, and you may wish to investigate it, but it is quite costly.

Phoenix
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