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Searched for: platinum dreams
23 Jul 2020 13:36
  • hby0214
  • hby0214's Avatar
Hi Sweet Dreams and Phoenix,

Thank you so much for the response and detailed info.

So here's my conundrum. Before I buy the mattress, I want to test it out. (Before actually going, I'll go through the mattress shopping guidelines on TMU.) The two places you recommended, CozyPure and Richmond Bedding, are incredibly far away for a mattress test. The two way drive is almost 12 hours or more. With school almost starting, I don't think that's a feasible trip to just test out a mattress.

Having said that, out of the three name brand mattress lines I listed before (TEMPUR-breeze, Serta iComfort, Beautyrest Platinum) are available at outlets in the Roanoke area. Which one in your experience would more likely serve me best for at least 4 years? Like Phoenix said, " it is not so much a matter of mattress longevity as you are seeking to get only 4 years of useful life, but depending on the foam density used in this particular model you may start to experience the effects of foam breakdown much before the 4 years mark given your tight hip flexors." I know it's hard to compare, given that there aren't any spring densities on them. But you mentioned that these brands could work for some people. Given your vast experience in recommending mattresses for people and I'm sure listening to other people's experiences/stories, which would you estimate to less likely experience sagging?

Tomorrow, I will call some outlets with these name brands and see if they have any spec sheets that have comfort layer foam density information on them.

Best,
Hong
27 Oct 2018 17:14
  • Sweet Dreams
  • Sweet Dreams's Avatar
Penny Mustard sells a unique high quality 'Platinum Dreams' mattress lineup and are extremely transparent regarding their construction clearly detailing the specs of each layer. The only thing that prevented me from buying a mattress from them is that they have no money back guarantee, but instead offer a one year one time replacement option which gives you 75% of your purchase price to apply towards another model. Glad that your choice is working out so well for you! :cheer:
27 Oct 2018 09:14
  • Maxxpower
  • Maxxpower's Avatar
Just wanted to provide an update that this mattress has been great 3 years later. The ability to flip and rotate keeps it like new. Nice and cool. No back issues since (knock on wood).
Would buy another one despite the high cost.

Platinum Dreams

Thanks for the help on this forum, I came back to research pillows, so i figured the least I could do is provide an update that may help others.
03 Oct 2015 06:56
  • Maxxpower
  • Maxxpower's Avatar
Phoenix,

Just wanted to thank you for your help.

We selected the Platinum Dreams Marsala Medium and have had it for a week..

So far its been great, excellent support and way less heat retention then the last mattress.

You can definitely smell that we have 100 + pounds of latex in the in the house, but the smell is diminishing fairly quickly and is to be expected.

We are happy to have a 2 sided mattress that hopefully will last 15 to 20 years with regular flipping.

Thanks for your help!
29 Sep 2015 19:36
  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
Hi Lost,

To get to the point, I am not a fan of spring mattresses, and I would like a bed that will last a long time. IKEA was having a sale this month with their foam and latex mattresses 15% off. I really liked their Morgongava 100% latex mattress, and we were going to buy it when someone else bought the last mattress 30 minutes before we got there.


As long as the materials in a mattress you are considering are durable enough for your body type and meet the guidelines here ... the choice between different types and combinations of materials and components or different types of mattresses (see this article ) are more of a preference and a budget choice than a "better/worse" choice.

In other words ... one type of mattress isn't inherently better or worse than another as long as a mattress you purchase is a good match for you in terms of PPP, uses good quality and durable materials, and compares well to the other mattresses you are considering based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.

While there is no way to quantify how long any mattress will last for a specific person or predict exactly when you will decide to replace it because it is no longer suitable or comfortable for you (because this is the only real measure of durability or the useful life of a mattress that really matters) because there are too many unknowns and variables involved that are unique to each person ... if a mattress is well inside a suitable comfort/support range and isn't close to the edge of being too soft when it is new (see post #2 here ) and meets the minimum quality/durability specs that are suggested in the guidelines here then it would be reasonable to expect a useful lifetime in the range of 7 - 10 years and with higher quality and more durable materials like latex or higher density memory foam or polyfoam (in the comfort layers especially) it would likely be in the higher end of the range or even longer.

There is also more detailed information about the many variables that can affect the durability and useful life of a mattress relative to different people in post #4 here and the posts it links to.

Later that night I discovered this website, as well as Sleep EZ. Even though we will be blowing our original bed budget by 25%, we are looking at buying the 8" Natural Latex Mattress in Queen size with the layers as follows: 2" soft talalay, 3" medium Dunlop, and 3" of firm Dunlop latex foam. I guess this is the most common arrangement. I am a little nervous buying the mattress because it is a lot of money at $1,245, and because we have not tried it out in person. Also, I seem to like and need a softer bed, and my boyfriend thinks he wants a firmer bed, though he can sleep on anything and also likes our travel trailer bed. Finally, does anyone have anything good or bad to say about the thin cotton/rayon mattress cover that comes with this mattress instead of their normal, thick cotton and wool cover? From what they told me, you can feel the actual latex a lot more with the thin cover, and some people really like that according to the guy on the phone.


I'm assuming that you've read the mattress shopping tutorial here which includes all the basic information, steps, and guidelines that can help you make the best possible choice ... and perhaps most importantly know how and why to avoid the worst ones.

Two of the most important links in the tutorial that I would especially make sure you read are post #2 here which has more about the different ways to choose a suitable mattress (either locally or online) that is the best "match" for you in terms of "comfort" and PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and Personal preferences) that can help you assess and minimize the risks of making a choice that doesn't turn out as well as you hoped for and post #13 here which has more about the most important parts of the "value" of a mattress purchase which can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses in terms of suitability (how well you will sleep), durability (how long you will sleep well), and the overall value of a mattress compared to your other finalists (based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you).

What do you guys think about going with a soft, medium firm arrangement? I wonder what it will be like compared to sleeping on 4" of medium foam? Do you think Sleep EZ beds are a good value today? Does anyone have any warning advice for me? Sometimes I can be too optimistic and not objective enough when I really want to buy something, so I am scared and looking for things to look out for and/or some reassurance that this bed will be a good buy.


I would always keep in mind that the first "rule" of mattress shopping is to remember that you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress and there are too many unknowns, variables, and personal preferences involved that are unique to each person to use a formula or for anyone to be able to predict or make a specific suggestion or recommendation about which mattress or combination of materials and components or which type of mattress would be the best "match" for you in terms of "comfort" or PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your Personal preferences) or how a mattress will "feel" to you or compare to another mattress based on specs (either yours or a mattress) or "theory at a distance" that can possibly be more accurate than your own careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in step 4 of the tutorial) or your own personal sleeping experience (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here ).

While your own careful testing or personal experience is the most reliable way to know whether a mattress is a good "match" for you in terms of comfort and PPP ... when you can't test a mattress in person then the most reliable source of guidance is always a more detailed phone conversation with a knowledgeable and experienced retailer or manufacturer that has your best interests at heart (which would include SleepEZ) and who can help "talk you through" the specifics of their mattresses and the properties and "feel" of the materials they are using (fast or slow response, resilience, firmness etc) and the options they have available that may be the best "match" for you based on the information you provide them, any local testing you have done or mattresses you have slept on and liked or other mattresses you are considering that they are familiar with, and the "averages" of other customers that are similar to you. They will know more about "matching" their specific mattress designs to different body types, sleeping positions, and preferences (or to other mattresses that they are familiar with) than anyone else.

While other people's comments about the knowledge and service of a particular business can certainly be very helpful ... I would be very cautious about about using other people's experiences or reviews on a mattress (either positive or negative) as a reliable source of information or guidance about how you will feel on the same mattress or how suitable or how durable a mattress may be for you and in many if not most cases they can be more misleading than helpful because any mattress that would be a perfect choice for one person or even a larger group of people may be completely unsuitable for someone else to sleep on (see post #13 here ).

There is also more about the pros and cons of a quilted cover in post #12 here and there is more about the pros and cons of a wool quilted cover vs a thinner more stretchy non quilted cover in post #6 here .

As you probably know from your reading here SleepEZ is also one of the members here which means that I think very highly of them and I believe that they compete well with the best in the industry in terms of their quality, value, service, and transparency.

While I can't speak to how any mattress will "feel" for someone else because this is too subjective and relative to different body types, sleeping positions, and individual preferences, sensitivities, and circumstances ... outside of PPP the most important part of the value of a mattress purchase is durability which is all about how long you will sleep well on a mattress. The mattress you are considering uses very high quality materials (100% natural Dunlop latex and 100% natural Talalay latex) and there are no lower quality materials or weak links in the mattress so it would make a very durable choice.

What do you guys think of the Platinum Mattress Protector by Leggett and Platt that Sleep EZ sells? Does it sleep hot? Does it feel like you are sleeping on plastic?


There is more about the pros and cons of different types of mattress protectors in post #89 here . The "thin membrane" types of protectors like the platinum are a popular choice and generally have little effect on the feel and performance of a mattress and they don't feel like plastic but for some people the semi breathable membrane in these types of protectors can impair airflow enough that they can sleep warmer than they would compared to other types of protectors without the membrane that are more breathable.

Phoenix
08 Sep 2015 18:20
  • Maxxpower
  • Maxxpower's Avatar
Hi Phoenix,

Thanks for the reply. I am glad you feel that the materials are premium and there are no obvious weak links.

Option 2 . www.pennymustard.com/Platinum-Dreams-King-Marsala-Mattress-Plush/MARS66-PL-1406/ItemInformation.aspx is what we both felt was the right mattress.

My only other concern is that while this PLUSH mattress provided good PPP now, how much will it change in the next 6 months and will I regret not getting the medium which also felt good but slightly firm when laying on the side.

I am hoping that because of the premium construction of this mattress, the comfort layer would not "settle causing spinal misalignment as this is a relatively soft mattress.

In your experience, do many people regret going too soft or too firm with a full latex mattress?

Thanks for your help!
07 Sep 2015 19:50
  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
Hi Maxxpower,

We have decided that we are willing to spend more on a 2 sided mattress as our current one is just about unusable due to the giant craters in it (single sided). We have found a reputable local retailer and wanted to hear what the forum has to say about these options;


There is more about the pros and cons of one sided vs two sided mattresses in post #3 here . While a one sided mattress that meets the quality/durability guidelines here and that doesn't have any lower quality materials or weak links can certainly make a durable choice ... a two sided mattress would last longer than a similar mattress with a similar support system that used the same comfort layers on only one side of the mattress as long as you flip and rotate it on a regular basis (see post #2 here ).

There is also more about the 3 most important parts of "value" of a mattress purchase in post #13 here which can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses in terms of suitability (how well you will sleep), durability (how long you will sleep well), and the overall value of a mattress compared to your other finalists based on suitability, durability, and all the other parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you).

Option 1:. www.pennymustard.com/Platinum-Dreams-Kin...ItemInformation.aspx This is an all latex 2 sided mattress. The link shows its construction which appears to be very well made. This mattress felt firm but comfortable.

Option 2: www.pennymustard.com/Platinum-Dreams-Kin...ItemInformation.aspx This is an all latex 2 sided mattress. The link shows its construction which appears to be very well made. This mattress felt very nice. It is a slightly softer version of option 1

Option 3: www.pennymustard.com/Platinum-Dreams-Kin...ItemInformation.aspx This mattress has a spring core as opposed to being solid latex. It felt the most comfortable out of the 3 but it was massively thick.


I would keep in mind that the first "rule" of mattress shopping is to always remember that you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress and there are too many unknowns, variables, and personal preferences involved that are unique to each person to use a formula or for anyone to be able to predict or make a specific suggestion or recommendation about which mattress or combination of materials and components or which type of mattress would be the best "match" for you in terms of "comfort" or PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and Personal preferences) or how a mattress will "feel" to you or compare to another mattress based on specs (either yours or a mattress) or "theory at a distance" that can possibly be more accurate than your own careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in step 4 of the tutorial) or if you can't test a mattress in person then your own personal sleeping experience (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here ).

Outside of PPP ... the most important part of the value of a mattress purchase is durability and the durability and useful life of a mattress depends on its construction and the type and quality of the materials inside it regardless of the name of the manufacturer on the label. That's one of the reasons that It's always refreshing to see a manufacturer like Clare Bedding that is transparent about all the materials and components in their mattresses and all of these mattresses use high quality and durable materials and there are no lower quality materials or weak links in any of them so if any or all of them are a good "match" for you in terms of PPP and all the other parts of your personal value equation that are important to you then they would certainly be well worth considering.

- Concerned about the 1" thick layer of wool over the latex. Will this flatten out and get lumpy and hard over time


Wool is one of the best temperature regulating materials in the industry and while it will compress by about 30% of it's thickness over time and the initial compression will be more where you sleep most on the mattress ... with only an inch of wool this won't have any meaningful effect on the comfort or support of the mattress and it will also even out over time as you sleep in different areas of the mattress and flip the mattress over on a regular basis so it's certainly not something that I would have any concerns about.

- Concerned about getting the right firmness (side sleepers)


Your own careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in the tutorial) and personal experience will always be the most reliable way to know whether any mattress is a good "match" for you in terms of firmness, comfort, and PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your own Personal preferences).

There is also more about the different ways to choose a suitable mattress (either locally or online) that is the best "match" for you in terms of comfort and PPP in post #2 here that can help you assess and minimize the risks of making a choice that doesn't turn out as well as you hoped for once you actually sleep on your mattress in "real life".

- Concerned about heat retention in these mattresses (sleeping hot)


While it's not possible to quantify the sleeping temperature of a mattress for any particular person with any real accuracy because there are so many variables involved including the type of mattress protector and the sheets and bedding that you use (which in many cases can have just as significant an effect on temperature as the type of foam in a mattress) and on where you are in the "oven to iceberg" range and because there is no standardized testing for temperature regulation with different combinations of materials ... there is more about the many variables that can affect the sleeping temperature of a mattress or sleeping system in post #2 here that can help you choose the types of materials and components that are most likely to keep you in a comfortable temperature range.

Wool is among the best temperature regulating materials and latex in general is the most breathable and temperature neutral of all the foam materials so it would be very unlikely that someone would have any temperature regulation issues with a mattress that has a wool quilted cotton cover and latex comfort layers.

- Concerned about the longevity of option 3 as some of the foam is not latex


The 2.5 lb polyfoam in the third mattress you linked is a very high quality and durable material which are well above the minimum guidelines that are suggested in the quality/durability guidelines here so there wouldn't be any cause for concern or weak links in the mattress in terms of durability.

Phoenix
07 Sep 2015 17:53
  • Maxxpower
  • Maxxpower's Avatar
Hi, I have already learned a lot from researching and lurking on this forum. Our bad experience with our last mattress has pushed me to spend more time selecting a quality mattress..
We have decided that we are willing to spend more on a 2 sided mattress as our current one is just about unusable due to the giant craters in it (single sided). We have found a reputable local retailer and wanted to hear what the forum has to say about these options;

Option 1:. www.pennymustard.com/Platinum-Dreams-King-Marsala-Mattress-Medium/MARS66-MED-1406/ItemInformation.aspx This is an all latex 2 sided mattress. The link shows its construction which appears to be very well made. This mattress felt firm but comfortable.

Option 2: www.pennymustard.com/Platinum-Dreams-King-Marsala-Mattress-Plush/MARS66-PL-1406/ItemInformation.aspx This is an all latex 2 sided mattress. The link shows its construction which appears to be very well made. This mattress felt very nice. It is a slightly softer version of option 1

Option 3: www.pennymustard.com/Platinum-Dreams-King-Orchid-Mattress-Medium/ORCH66-MED-1406/ItemInformation.aspx This mattress has a spring core as opposed to being solid latex. It felt the most comfortable out of the 3 but it was massively thick.

My concerns for all of them;
- Concerned about the 1" thick layer of wool over the latex. Will this flatten out and get lumpy and hard over time
- Concerned about getting the right firmness (side sleepers)
- Concerned about heat retention in these mattresses (sleeping hot)
- Concerned about the longevity of option 3 as some of the foam is not latex

We have spent a fair amount of time on all of them and they all feel pretty good and provide spinal alignment.
Any advice would be appreciated.
Thanks!
01 Dec 2014 20:09
  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
Hi Triumph3,

I wish I found the site sooner.


I wish you had found us sooner as well since it would have helped you avoid all of the choices you ended up making ... but of course that didn't happen so the best that can happen now is to make the best of a difficult situation where you really don't have any great options available to you (unless you were somehow able to get a refund for your mattress and start all over again using a very different approach to finding a mattress).

She loves the pillow tops but after my last experience I figured it would be better to get a firm matress and soften it with a topper so it wont sag as quick as my last one. SO, ended up at raymour and flannigan because I was able to finance it. We both loved the feel of the beautyrest world class royal palms plush but it was a pillow top so I got the firm version which didn't feel all that firm in the store In order to avoid my previous experience.


Unfortunately you inadvertently ended up repeating your previous experience by buying a major brand mattress which has lower quality and less durable materials in the comfort layers ... even though they may be firmer. These are the types of mattresses I would avoid in any firmness level (see the guidelines here ).

You can also read my thoughts about buying a firmer mattress and then adding a topper afterwards in post #2 here and unless you can test the specific combination in person to make sure it's a good match for you in terms of PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and Personal preferences) it can be a very risky approach that can be even more difficult than just finding a suitable mattress in the first place because choosing a topper that is a good match for both you and the mattress you are using it on can be a very uncertain process that involves some trial and error.

If you did choose to go in this direction then the Beautyrest world class royal palms firmBeautyrest world class royal palms firm is in a higher budget range than you would need if you are adding your own comfort layers in the form of a topper and I would probably have used a lower cost mattress as the "base" under your topper since by buying the Beautyrest world class royal palms firm you are really only buying foam layers (and lower quality at that) that you really don't need and that can be more of a liability than a benefit. While a topper will help with the durability of the Beautyrest world class royal palms firm ... it would still be a lower quality and less durable choice for a base mattress under a topper than I would normally consider.

The semi good news is I purchased a 30 day guarantee so we can exchange the mattress for another one there.


I'm not sure how helpful this is because their 45 day comfort guarantee only applies to mattresses in the same or higher price range and there isn't a higher priced mattress (or any mattress for that matter) that I would normally consider there and you would only be using good money to chase after bad IMO (unless they carry a mattress I don't know about that would be a good match for you in terms of PPP without a topper and where you can find out the specifics of all the layers to confirm that it doesn't have any weak links in the materials ... see this article ).

should i try a latex topper and/or a feather bed?


The choice of material for a topper is a personal preference so it would depend on how you like the feel and performance of latex. Latex is a very durable material and it can certainly make a good choice for a topper for those who like it but I would spend some time testing different types and firmness levels of latex in some local stores to get a better sense of whether you like the "feel" of latex and if you do which which type of latex you tend to prefer. There is more about the differences between memory foam and latex in post #2 here and there is more about the difference between the feel of Talalay and Dunlop latex in post #7 here .

I would tend to be cautious with a featherbed because it's more of a "feel" item that is much less resilient and supportive and less pressure relieving overall than a foam topper. There is more about featherbeds or fiberbeds in post #2 here and the other posts it links to.


So overall ... since you aren't experiencing any back pains on your mattress and it appears that all you need is some additional softness and pressure relief ... it seems to me that the best of some "not so good" options would be to choose a topper that is a good match for both you and your mattress so that you can add the additional softness and pressure relief that you need on your mattress. It would also have the side benefit of extending the useful life of your mattress as well so that the lower quality materials in the Beautyrest Black will soften and break down a little more slowly.

Once you have decided on the type of material that you would prefer in a topper (including testing some latex locally to see if you like how it feels in general terms) then post #2 here and the additional topper guidelines it links to can help you use your sleeping experience on your mattress to choose the type, thickness, and firmness for a topper that would have the best chance of success. It also includes a link to some of the better online topper sources I'm aware of.

sleep on latex - sleeponlatex.com/


You can see my thoughts about Karl and Sleeponlatex in post #4 here and post #3 here and a forum search on " sleeponlatex " will bring up more information and feedback about them as well. They are one of the sources that are included in the topper list I linked and if you like Dunlop latex then they would certainly be worth talking with.

www.ultimatesleep.com/talalay-latex-toppers


You can read more of my thoughts about Ultimate Sleep in this topic and as you can see I would be very cautious here and would probably look elsewhere.

Phoenix
14 Oct 2013 20:03
  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
Hi ShopperGirl,

You know...I really think the difference is in the thickness of the layers. I found a mattress at Penny Mustard that felt really, REALLY good. But rather than three, three-inch layers like the Savvy Rest, it has one six inch soft talalay layer in the middle,and one inch of medium talalay on the top. It is a very squishy soft mattress--just like I like.


You're very right that the thickness of each layer along with the softness of each layer and other foam specs as well such as compression modulus and others are all part of how all the layers and components of a mattress interact together to create the feel and performance of a mattress. You can see a few of the factors involved in post #2 here but learning all the technical aspects of mattress design and theory can be a long learning curve and in the end still won't tell you any more about which mattress is more suitable for you than your own personal experience. Some of this is quite counterintuitive in many cases.

I think that the actual soft latex would be fairly close but there is a significant difference in the layer thickness and design. The Platinum Dreams says they use 24 ILD which would be fairly close to the ILD of the soft Talalay latex that Savvy Rest uses in their soft layers as well although latex that is made by different manufacturers isn't always directly comparable.

All of this is fairly technical though and the most important thing is your own personal experience and finding a way to sleep soundly over the course of the night :)

Phoenix
06 Oct 2013 21:07
  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
Hi DogLover,

A forum search on Penny Mustard and Platinum Dreams (you can just click both of these) will bring up more information and comments about both of them.

(1) When I asked the sales associate where the latex was sourced from (EG: Latex International, etc.), she said she didn't know and that "they won't tell us." ("They" being the Michigan company that makes their mattresses. When I asked what company in MI made their mattresses, she said, "I don't know." Oy.) So, although they say it is "all natural," I assume that could still mean it is a blend. If so, is that really such a bad thing? (I'm new to this whole latex mattress thing, so forgive my ignorance!)


Platinum Dreams mattresses are made by Clare Bedding which is the Restonic Licencee in their area. Restonic sources its Talalay latex from Latex international as far as I know.

Latex International makes both 100% natural Talalay and blended Talalay. The blended comes in ILD's of 14, 19, 24, 28, 32, 36, 40, and 44. the 100% natural comes in firmness ranges from N1 to N5. If the ILD's are correct it would indicate that the Talalay latex they use is blended which many manufacturers call "natural" vs "all natural" which refers to the 100% natural ( see here ). It certainly gets confusing because if a manufacturer said that their mattresses contained all "natural" latex it can be read to mean that all of the latex in the mattress is "natural" (which is blended) while if they say all the latex is "all natural" this would indicate that the latex is 100% natural. The terminology is confusing and often leads to manufacturers and retailers confusing which is which.

(2) I asked what the "Miliken Paladin" fire retardant barrier was comprised of and, again, she responded with "I don't know." After some research it "seems" to me as if this is a low toxicity (although not completely non-toxic" substance (silica, if I am not mistaken). However, I'm not a scientist, so I don't know what I don't know. :unsure:


I would consider a viscose/silica inherent fire barrier to be non toxic. you can read more about this type of fire barrier in post #2 here and the post it links to.

(3) Penny Mustard a "365 day comfort guarantee." Now, a comfort guarantee sounds nice, but I am always a bit concerned with companies with such liberal return policies; I often wonder if they just repackage the mattersses and send them out again. (A former boyfriend worked in a furniture store that did such returns (NOT Penny Mustard--he worked at a store that has since gone bankrupt) and he told me the sales reps were told to say that returned mattresses were sent to "outlets," but in reality they put them back into circulation. I asked him how that could happen because I thought that wasn't legal and his response was, "Who's gonna police it?" Yuk! So, that has always made me a little leary of working with companies that allow people to return mattresses. BUT..that could just be m paranoai based on my former friend's comments. Adding to my paranoia, of course, is PM's requirment that you buy a $60 mattress cover because, "We can't take the mattress back if it has any soil or stains on it. "It must look like new condition," according to the sales associate. Hmmm.....


It would be illegal to repackage the mattress and sell them again as new and while it's possible (and some stores have been caught doing just that) ... it's not likely IMO that they are one of them. They are usually sold to liquidation outlets who will often sell them as "scratch and dents" etc. The requirement for a mattress cover and no stains of any kind is so that employees don't have to handle a mattress with stains and the health issues that could be connected with this. Of course a stain could also affect their ability to re-sell the mattress to a liquidator or clearance store after it's been sanitized. The cost of comfort returns are built into the cost of the mattress and in some cases it can result in people who are more careful in their mattress choices and don't need a comfort exchange paying for the exchanges for people who test less carefully.

I really liked the feel of the Penny Mustard mattress better than the Savvy Rest, but am wondering about the quality of the PM mattress. They also put their mattress on a box spring. I asked the sales associate if it was okay to put it on a slatted platform bed, and she looked shocked and said, "Oh, NO! A slatted platform offers NO support for the mattress! You need a SOLID platform--or a boxspring like this." When I told her that my research indicated that a slatted platform with the slats no more than two inches apart was best, because it allowed for circulation under the mattress, she disagreed. Yet, their "boxspring" (which was a few wood planks on the bottom and very hard steel / wire on top? seemed to me to be the same concept as the slatted platform. (Right now I have an old spring mattress and traditional box spring so, again, all of this is new to me.)


A mattress is only as good as its construction and the quality of the components and materials inside it. Both of these use latex which is a high quality material regardless of the type of latex used. Savvy Rest has a more flexible design because it allows for re-arranging or exchanging layers which can fine tune the mattress after a purchase in many ways while with the Restonic you are limited to the actual design of the mattress. The Platinum Dreams is two sided and two sided designs (that are flipped regularly) are more durable than a similar one sided design. With layered latex mattresses with a zip cover you can also replace just a single layer though if the top layer softens before the rest. Savvy Rest uses either organic Dunlop or 100% natural Talalay while the Restonic appears to use blended Talalay. You can read more about the different types of latex in post #6 here and more about blended vs 100% natural Talalay latex in post #2 here .

I really liked the feel of the Penny Mustard mattress better than the Savvy Rest, but am wondering about the quality of the PM mattress. They also put their mattress on a box spring. I asked the sales associate if it was okay to put it on a slatted platform bed, and she looked shocked and said, "Oh, NO! A slatted platform offers NO support for the mattress! You need a SOLID platform--or a boxspring like this." When I told her that my research indicated that a slatted platform with the slats no more than two inches apart was best, because it allowed for circulation under the mattress, she disagreed. Yet, their "boxspring" (which was a few wood planks on the bottom and very hard steel / wire on top? seemed to me to be the same concept as the slatted platform. (Right now I have an old spring mattress and traditional box spring so, again, all of this is new to me.)


You can read more about the different types of support systems that are generally used or appropriate for different types of mattresses in the foundation post here and the two other posts it links to in the second paragraph. Box springs are generally used for innerspring mattresses although there are some latex mattress manufacturers that use them under a latex mattress (generally thinner) because the box spring can change the feel of the mattress and is designed as part of the sleeping system. With thicker latex mattresses it's generally not necessary and in most cases even desirable. A box spring that flexes can change the feel of a mattress vs a solid non flexing foundation or platform bed that doesn't flex. You can also read more about a solid platform vs a slatted surface in post #10 here . It sounds to me like their "box spring" may be a wire grid type which is a semi flex (not a box spring with actual springs which which flex) and you can see my thoughts about these with an all latex mattress (with latex in the bottom layer of the mattress) in post #10 here .


@dn,

7. It's surprising they add a chemical fire barrier at all, assuming you're correct about that. They use organic ticking and organic wool, and natural talalay. The wool would often be used to achieve fire barrier, and otherwise a mattress like that would often be sold as a premium 'organic', 'all natural', 'without chemicals' mattress at a higher price.


Wool needs to be needle punched and used in a certain amount and way to pass the fire code and it's often just as easy (and less costly) for a manufacturer to use an inherent fire barrier which gives the flexibility to either use less wool or use it in different ways. The viscose/silica fire barriers aren't a "chemical" fire barrier and are non toxic. You can read more about wool fire barriers in this article that is written by someone that I respect highly and is very knowledgeable about passing the fire regulations.

Both of these mattresses use high quality materials and there are no obvious weak links in their designs.

Phoenix
26 Apr 2013 11:55
  • jhcoleman18
  • jhcoleman18's Avatar
Hi-
I've been reading this forum during my search for a mattress and appreciate everyone's insight very much. I'm a little different than the average mattress shopper- I have very serious injuries- they are muscular in nature and entrap nerves (nothing spinal). The "right" Beds are hard to generalize for me but most likely include

- a very soft pillow top *very soft*
- Very good supportive coils - but not heavy guage or those with strong resistence (I've rejected OMF orthopedic line with 12.5 gauge coils)
- No memory foam- or very little but many layers down
- Generally no latex on top- it provides too much resistence back on my muscles

I don't frankly care if the mattress is a good value or if it will last forever right now. I'd be happy if it lasted 1-2 years and would let me recover, but I've been through 3 mattresses and am now on a horrifying Sleep Number trial that's killing me (too hard above 30 PSI for my body and at 30 PSI my body hammocks/sinks in so far it's also detrimental).

Any thoughts? I'm in Minneapolis/St Paul and have been to look at and/or purchased from:

OMF
Restwell Mattress factory
Mattress Firm (Simmons, Sealy, S&F)
A Savvy Rest dealer
Natural Mattress Co
Platinum Dreams line at PM Bedroom Gallery
Room & Board
Sleep Number

A return policy is also pretty necessary since I never know if something is good in the store. Thank you!!!
06 Jan 2013 16:29
  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
Hi Diddlydo,

Thanks for the heads up about PM Bedroom Gallery in Minnesota no longer carrying the all latex Platinum Dreams. Their sister store (Penny Mustard) still does but the brother that runs PM decided not to carry them any longer although they still carry Platinum Dreams.

I think the first thing I would do is focus on the mattress itself which is your primary purchase without considering how it may feel on an adjustable bed in different positions (this is a sales technique that is often used to sell a mattress). Any suitable mattress (foam or an innerspring that can bend) can be used on an adjustable bed so I would only test mattresses in the flat position. Once you have decided on a mattress based on its own merits ... then you can consider adding an adjustable foundation to your purchase.

A mattress is only as good as the construction and materials that are in it so I would never consider buying a mattress where I didn't know the specific details of what was in it. "Foam" is way too generic a description and could mean almost anything from "throwaway junk" that won't last to very high quality. You can't feel the quality of a mattress in a showroom because low quality and high quality materials can both feel great. Low quality doesn't stay feeling great for very long however. The best way I know to buy a mattress is to follow the steps in post #1 here . This will help connect you to better manufacturers and retailers that are more committed to helping you find a mattress that best meets your needs and preferences and has the best possible quality and value in your price range without resorting to gimmicks or sales techniques to sell a mattress.

Once you have decided on a mattress then you can consider whether or not you want to add an adjustable bed as an option.

For most people ... an adjustable bed is a luxury and not a "need". It's used for reading, watching TV or a movie, working in bed on a laptop, a meal in bed, or for some of the other optional features such as massage. We have one and for these things it's great and each person can decide for themselves if the cost is "worth it" based on how they feel about the options they make possible and on how much they think they would use them.

In some cases they can also be used for medical reasons which can benefit from elevated sleeping such as acid reflux or some heart or circulatory conditions etc. Some beds even have a snore position so if one half of a couple starts snoring (on their back) the other one can elevate their torso slightly which can often stop the snoring and then after a timed interval the bed goes back down but this would generally need a split adjustable and mattresses that can operate each side independently.

If you are an exclusive back sleeper and don't sleep in any other positions (side or stomach) then there are also benefits that can come from elevating the knees similar to putting a pillow under the knees because this can rotate the pelvis and relieve some pressure and stress on the lumbar area and can help with some circulatory conditions as well. If you sleep in any other positions (side or stomach) then having the bed elevated is of course not really suitable except a small amount of elevation in the foot of the bed can still be OK for some side sleepers and can help when they are on their back.

If you are considering an adjustable bed it would be important to check with the manufacturer or retailer of the mattress to make sure that the mattress is suitable for use on an adjustable base and that using an adjustable base wouldn't damage the mattress or void the warranty. In general terms ... foam materials such as latex, memory foam, or polyfoam along with most pocket coils are "bendable" and flexible enough to use with an adjustable bed but thicker layers of firmer polyfoam or thicker mattresses may not contour as well to the different positions and in some cases the constant bending can affect the durability of the foam so I would always make sure you confirm with the manufacturer or retailer that your mattress is suitable for use with an adjustable bed.

Since most of the well known adjustable bed manufacturers are reliable ... I would choose between them based on price and features comparisons that include the features and benefits that are most important to you. The adjustable bed thread here has more information that you can use to make price/features comparisons between the more popular manufacturers and also includes some links to some sources you can use for pricing reference purposes (there can be a wide range of prices for the same models from store to store).

When you are testing mattresses though ... I could compare them based on their relative quality and value and on their suitability for your specific needs and preferences without regard to how they may feel on an adjustable bed because an adjustable bed and the benefits that come from them can be used under any suitable mattress (that can bend). Again though ... I would consider the purchase of an adjustable bed as more of a features vs price purchase because all of them perform the same basic functions and the main differences between them are the additional features and options they have.

Phoenix

@whoever,

gravity pulls us down the longer we sleep

This guy must be an unemployed physicist.


That must be true. If he was an unemployed gerontologist or plastic surgeon he would have said "the longer we live the more gravity pulls everything down" and been selling something else completely :)
06 Jul 2012 14:52
  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
Hi terminaldawn ... and Maia,

@Mai

Thanks so much for the suggestions. I'll also add a few comments about each of them based on my thoughts about and conversations with them :)

@ terminaldawn,

You still have some very good options in the general area (including maia's suggestions) which IMO would well justify a phone call and probably a visit. the travel time (after a call) would easily be justified by the time it would save you in researching and finding a great choice and based on the prices you were quoting there is a lot better value available to you in the area. (I'm still somewhat shell shocked by the prices they quoted you)

www.pennymustard.com/ They are a retail direct outlet for Claire Bedding which is a wholesale mattress manufacturer in Escanabe, MI. They are a Restonic licensee and also make their own line called Platinum Dreams which are very nice and include several 2 sided all latex mattresses and others. In my conversations with both Clare bedding and Pennymustard I have found them to be open and helpful about their mattresses and they are good people. Of course each of the pennymustard outlets may have different people but I would suspect that they would all be higher quality salespeople that are more knowledgeable than most.

www.verlo.com/customerservice/stores/WI also makes a full range of mattresses including all latex and other styles. They too have better quality and value and would be well worth a trip. They have outlets that are within @ 20 miles from you.

The two members of this site that I mentioned in the previous post #2 in this thread are also reasonably close. I would definitely talk with them and include them in your research. they both make great quality and value mattresses and as you know the members of this site include some of the best value in the country.

www.thesleepshopappleton.com/contact.html They are a factory direct manufacturer in Appleton which is closer to Green Bay and a little further yet (which is why I didn't list them in the earlier post) but they also make some great quality and value mattresses. They make all latex (Talalay), latex innrspring hybrids (of various types), memory foam (5 lb) and use very high quality polyfoam in their mattresses that use it. The lowest quality poly they use in the comfort layers for example is 1.8 lbs in their low budget mattresses and it goes up from there. They are the type of manufacturer that I wouldn't hesitate to recommend and are also among the best in terms of quality and value. They are also very open about the materials they use, knowledgeable and clearly "mattress people".

Savvyrest is a good testing ground for different latex layers in preparation for an online purchase as maia mentioned (they are also priced too high IMO) but when you have such good quality and value available to you within reasonable driving distance ... I would tend to focus on local first.

So you still have some great options remaining which would allow you to have the best of both worlds ... the chance to test a mattress locally and the quality and value that of course everyone wants.

Phoenix
31 May 2012 16:41
  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
Hi schil131,

I'm hoping to get some general thoughts on the Platinum Dreams "Franco" mattress, which is a Restonic mattress sold by P.M. Bedroom Gallery in Minnesota (www.pmbedroomgallery-mn.com/mattresses/piece.cfm?c_id=235) and, more generally, on whether it makes sense to put a latex comfort layer on top of a memory foam layer -- or whether that is more of a gimmicky marketing strategy.


I personally like the feel of thinner layers of latex over memory foam and it helps to "modify" the feel of the memory foam and create a more lively and less "hold you in place" surface which still has the "sinking in" feeling of memory foam. It can also help to add to the breathability of the mattress surface layers.

Having said that ... it appears to me that the 3/4" layer of 1.8 lb "engineered airflow latex" may not be latex at all but a higher quality polyfoam that has been "engineered" to perform more like latex. There is no latex that I'm aware of that is in this low a density range (even 14 ILD talalay has a higher density) and the specs are much more typical of polyfoam.

2) Is 1.5lbs a dense enough foam in the support layer? I believe I read somewhere on this forum that the minimum density should be at least 1.8 lbs. What would be the main consequence if the support layer is not dense enough?


I would also hesitate to use 1.5 lb polyfoam in the support core. While this is certainly a less expensive option than 1.8 lb or higher and it can be made firm enough to be used as a support layer (any density can be made in a wide range of softness/firmness levels) ... it is not as durable as 1.8 lb and will not keep it's supportive qualities as long. This would be something I would only consider for a lower budget mattress.

1) What would be the advantage of having a latex layer on top of the memory foam layer? On that note, they also sell another mattress (the "Estelle" -- not available on the website) that is identical to the "Franco," except that it has a 2" latex layer instead of a 0.75" latex layer. This makes the comfort layer a total of 6". Does that seem too thick for a side/stomach sleeper?


A thicker latex layer would give more of the response and feeling of latex and the memory foam underneath would become "slower" because the heat would reach it more slowly. I would personally prefer the thicker latex layer but as you mention this may make the upper layers rather thick/soft and I would make sure I tested carefully for alignment. I would personally prefer a thinner layer of memory foam to make up for the extra latex but each person's experience on a mattress would be the most accurate way to know for certain. this would be especially risky for someone who spent time on their stomach yes (and any 4" memory foam layer may have this risk depending on the height/weight/body shape and the time spent on the stomach).

Also, the salesperson told me that the thought the latex layer was 100% natural Talalay, but I have not been able to verify that.


While this is certainly possible ... you (or the sales person) could phone Clare Bedding (who makes the mattress) to find out for certain. The "odds" say it is probably the blended talalay. They have been very responsive to my calls in the past and they seem to be good people (although I'm surprised that they are labeling what appears to be polyfoam as "engineered latex".

Phoenix
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