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Pain BETWEEN Pressure Points for Side Sleeper 11 Mar 2017 18:23 #21

  • Maybe54
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Hi Inov,

What has happened to me that I find every word of this fascinating?! I too am sorry that you're back to the drawing board. I wish the prototype went softer just by using 3" of a softer latex, then I could test my theory about needing softer latex, or if it really is the the springs that are the culprit.

The prototype reminds me of the Casper's comfort layers: 1.5 inches of 13 ILD Dunlop, over 1 inch of memory foam (polyfoam as the base layer). We tried the Casper for a few months and we really loved the feel of it. But alas, we had the memory foam problem of feeling stuck in the bed and having a hard time turning around, and I had stiff shoulders all day, which for means TOO firm. (BTW we found Brooklyn Bedding's medium too firm as well).

I have decided to try the Luma mattress, knowing my shoulders start agreeing with latex when it is 19 ILD talalay or softer, but I"m nervous the springs will be too stiff for me. I know from that last hotel visit that I"m fine with almost no comfort layer if the springs are super squishy to sink into, and I'm close enough to feel them push back. If the Luma is too firm, I think the 1.5" top layer is short enough that I can add a 1" topper without causing other problems. I"d really like to find a springs + latex combination that works.

I wonder if you feel the pressure on your torso because you're pretty even in the hips and shoulders? I am very small framed up top and have large hips proportionally. I think when my hips can't sink into the material I"m slanted downward and all the pressure goes to my shoulders.

Meanwhile! I hope you find a good lead and get some good rest soon!

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Pain BETWEEN Pressure Points for Side Sleeper 12 Mar 2017 11:36 #22

  • phoenix
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Hi Eaturplants,

Welcome to the Mattress Forum! :cheer:

Thank you for your comments about your experience with the breaking-in of your Quality Sleep Shop Emily mattress. Your experience is a very good example of the time it takes for materials, especially higher quality ones, to adjust in a mattress (as well as you adjusting to the new mattress). And your example of “buying yourself some time” with the thin topper is a common practice by many who need help adjusting to a mattress that is more supportive/firmer than what they were used to sleeping upon.

Thanks again for taking the time to share your experiences, and I’m glad you’re now sleeping well.

Phoenix
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Pain BETWEEN Pressure Points for Side Sleeper 12 Mar 2017 11:57 #23

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Hi Maybe54,

Thanks again for your input – I appreciate it!

The prototype reminds me of the Casper's comfort layers: 1.5 inches of 13 ILD Dunlop, over 1 inch of memory foam (polyfoam as the base layer).

As a note for anyone reading this in the future, Casper’s current layers are 1.5" 3.5 lb ventilated polyfoam, 1.5" 4 lb 10 ILD Memory foam, 1.5" 2.5 lb polyfoam and a 5" 1.5 lb 36 ILD Polyfoam support core.

I have decided to try the Luma mattress, knowing my shoulders start agreeing with latex when it is 19 ILD talalay or softer, but I"m nervous the springs will be too stiff for me. I know from that last hotel visit that I"m fine with almost no comfort layer if the springs are super squishy to sink into, and I'm close enough to feel them push back.

I wouldn’t hesitate to give Luma (a new site member, by the way) a call before placing your order to learn more about their spring unit. It is supposed to be quite contouring, but as you’re already well aware, your own careful personal testing will be the final judge. It sounds like your description of the last hotel bed you tried is on where the springs have less resilience (what people often refer to as the “push back”.

I wonder if you feel the pressure on your torso because you're pretty even in the hips and shoulders? I am very small framed up top and have large hips proportionally. I think when my hips can't sink into the material I"m slanted downward and all the pressure goes to my shoulders.

If your hips are not allowed to sink in deeply enough, it can negatively impact your alignment, and will also not allow as much of your body at rest to be in supportive contact with your mattress, which can have the sensation of your hips and shoulder “bearing” too much of your weight. What you’re experiencing and describing does make sense.

I’ll be interested in learning about any conversation you may have with Luma, and any reactions you have with any new combinations you try. I appreciate you taking the time to provide the detailed feedback of your experiences.

Phoenix
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Pain BETWEEN Pressure Points for Side Sleeper 20 Nov 2017 15:37 #24

  • lnov
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Hi Maybe54,

It's been a while but just wanted to update you and The Mattress Underground. We spent the summer abroad and slept wonderfully with family and on Airbnb beds! So now back home to our Quality Sleep Shop's Katherine "Plush" mattress and it STILL hurts. I am more convinced than ever that the mattress we received was not the same one as we spent an hour or so trying. I remember that the sign posted in front of the mattress at their showroom listed "Talalay Latex" but we asked about details, Tim said it was actually a "nice Dunlop" with different specs. (I really don't know what we actually received - it was very confusing).

I finally got up the nerve to call Tim and explain our dilemma - that this bed, similar to the first Emily mattress that we got from them, felt nothing like the showroom model. Even with the topper, it was extremely hard. I haven't slept well since we've been back home. We needed some direction and help.

Tim said that there was nothing - NOTHING - that they could do for us because we had the mattress too long and he could no longer re-sell it (!) Re-sell a USED mattress!? I know that Maybe54 had mentioned that Tim was receptive to her situation after returning their mattress one year later (in her 2/28/17 post) so I'm wondering why we are being treated differently.

So, we are out more than $1500, as well as all of the time and energy and the going back-and-forth 50 miles each time. That's tough on us seniors, especially. The lack of sleep since we've had this mattress has negatively impacted our health. We had trusted Quality Sleep Shop.

So, we are shopping again for a new mattress, possibly just a regular innerspring. The mattress chains we've visited have provided wonderful, personalized service and recommendations. Pure Sleep actually has a mattress that you lie down on which takes computerized measurements of your body! They also have many more models to choose from. I don't know if their mattress will feel like the showroom models or not so we may try one of the many online mattress companies. Their return policies are fantastic and they seem to stand by their products.

Best to you, Maybe54! I'm curious to know if you've found "the one" :)

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Pain BETWEEN Pressure Points for Side Sleeper 25 Nov 2017 14:16 #25

  • phoenix
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Hi lnov,

I had to go back to previous posts and contact QSS to make sure I was accurate with my timeline, so I apologize for my delay in commenting upon your post.

It's been a while but just wanted to update you and The Mattress Underground. We spent the summer abroad and slept wonderfully with family and on Airbnb beds! So now back home to our Quality Sleep Shop's Katherine "Plush" mattress and it STILL hurts.


I hope you had a fun time in Europe this summer. I’m sorry you still don’t like the comfort of the Katherine Latex Soft mattress that you chose, but hopefully you were able to gather some information about the many beds you sampled in Europe, or at least have a grasp on the comfort that you preferred.

I am more convinced than ever that the mattress we received was not the same one as we spent an hour or so trying. I remember that the sign posted in front of the mattress at their showroom listed "Talalay Latex" but we asked about details, Tim said it was actually a "nice Dunlop" with different specs. (I really don't know what we actually received - it was very confusing).


QSS changed over from Talalay to Dunlop at the beginning of 2017, so your mattress most likely contains Dunlop latex. Regardless of Dunlop or Talalay, the floor models were representative of what they were shipping, and a Plush latex mattress, whether Talalay or Dunlop, will still be a quite soft product.

I finally got up the nerve to call Tim and explain our dilemma - that this bed, similar to the first Emily mattress that we got from them, felt nothing like the showroom model. Even with the topper, it was extremely hard. I haven't slept well since we've been back home. We needed some direction and help. Tim said that there was nothing - NOTHING - that they could do for us because we had the mattress too long.


There is always a break-in period for any new mattress where it loses its “false firmness” and this can be anywhere from a few weeks to a few months, depending upon configuration and materials being used, as well as the top of bed products being used at home.

It’s curious that it would take you about 9 months to “get up the nerve” to contact QSS, when you did so after only a few weeks of having your original mattress. Even with your summer travels, you had plenty of time in the winter and spring to contact them with any concerns regarding your product.

he could no longer re-sell it (!) Re-sell a USED mattress!?


QSS does not resell mattresses. They donate them to charity if they fall within the original comfort exchange plan. I asked Tim about this, and when asked about you returning a second mattress, his statement of, “It’s not like we can sell it or anything,” was meant to convey that there is no value in a mattress 300 days old and it’s even beyond the timeframe where they can donate it to their local charity. So this is a misinterpretation of his statement.

I know that Maybe54 had mentioned that Tim was receptive to her situation after returning their mattress one year later (in her 2/28/17 post) so I'm wondering why we are being treated differently.


You’re being treated exactly according to the return/exchange policy that QSS maintains.

Around December 2016 you purchased the standard Emily mattress from QSS. You felt that it was not a proper fit and wanted something softer, so you came back and chose the Katherine Latex Soft as a replacement product. The Katherine is offered in a Soft, Medium and Firm (all three are featured on QSS showroom floor), and in choosing the Soft you selected something that is significantly more plush than your original Emily mattress. Your replacement mattress was delivered January 10, 2017.

You next contacted QSS in November of 2017 (approximately 300 days after your original purchase) complaining that you were having issues and wanted a full refund for your mattress, which QSS denied per their 100 night trial policy, which is clearly posted on their web site , and you had already taken advantage of the one mattress exchange allowed per this policy. Which brings this to the present day.

I don’t know why you would expect QSS to extend their policy by 200 days and add an extra exchange (or a full refund). A business is under no obligation to modify their stated policies, and doing so for one (or multiple) customers would be no guarantee or entitlement that they would do so for anyone else. The reasoning for such policy exceptions are of course at the discretion of the business and the specific situation in question, including even the disposition of the consumer, but in the end it is a subjective determination the business alone is entitled to make, not the consumer (but requests of course can politely be made and it never hurts to inquire). Having clearly defined return/exchange policies serve as both protection for the consumer as well as the retailer.

So, we are out more than $1500, as well as all of the time and energy and the going back-and-forth 50 miles each time. That's tough on us seniors, especially. The lack of sleep since we've had this mattress has negatively impacted our health. We had trusted Quality Sleep Shop.


I’m sorry that the mattresses you chose didn’t work out for you, but despite your efforts to pick out something that you thought you might like, and QSS providing you two different products, there of course is no guarantee of comfort and appropriateness, and even with an exchange option, it’s part of the risk when purchasing any product that is subjective in nature.

So, we are shopping again for a new mattress, possibly just a regular innerspring. The mattress chains we've visited have provided wonderful, personalized service and recommendations.


As you’re starting your search process again, be sure to refer back to the mattress shopping tutorial and the steps listed there to assist you along the way.

Pure Sleep actually has a mattress that you lie down on which takes computerized measurements of your body!


Most of the pressure mapping systems are specific to a certain line of mattress and aren't really relevant to mattresses as a whole which have different constructions. They also only measure surface pressure (which you can often feel in your own personal testing) but don't provide input into alignment or how the pressure is distributed in the deeper body tissues or include the differences in physiology between people (pressure affects different people differently). There are a few more comments in post #2 here and post #4 here about pressure mapping systems.

Good luck in your new search!

Phoenix
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