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High Quality Latex vs Innerspring Quandary 03 Oct 2016 08:40 #1

  • steelwindmachine
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Thanks to this site, my wife and I have pretty much dialed in on a pair of mattresses we like from Shovlin Mattress Factory here in NJ.

Tri-Zone King set ((includes box spring) $2099 with separate Shovlin supplied topper ($149) ($2365.39 total w/frame after MU discount)
Warranty: 10 years pro-rated defect/3 years 100% replacement
  • Separate 2.375” thick Topper: three 5/8" High Density 1.8lb super soft polyfoams (1.875” total) + two 1/4" FR fire barriers and the fabric.
  • Quilted cover with 1-5/8" High Density 1.8lb super soft polyfoam + 1.5" of Dacron + 1/4 FR fire barrier and fabric
  • Comfort layer: 1" 2.4lb High Density High Resiliency polyfoam
  • Support layers: two 1/4" compressed cotton pads + additional 1/4" pad covering the center 1/3 of the mattress
  • Inner spring: 12.5 gauge double-offset, double-M edge support

M]ilan Pillow Top King set (includes box spring) $2899 ($3027.13 total w/frame after MU discount)
Warranty: 10 years pro-rated defect/5 years 100% replacement
  • Quilted cover with 1-5/8 " High Density 1.8lb super soft polyfoam + 1.5" of Dacron + 1/4 FR fire barrier and fabric
  • Topper Comfort layer: 1" of Talalay Latex (36 ILD)
  • Support layers: two 1/4" compressed cotton pads
  • Inner spring: 12.5 gauge double-offset, double-M edge support
Delivery is free.

The Tri-Zone feels nearly the same as the Milan with the separate Shovlin supplied topper.

My quandary is whether or not it's worthwhile for durability sake and bang for the buck to go with the Tri-Zone and a latex (Dunlop or Talalay) topper or try to ascertain what 100% latex mattress could replicate the same feel?

And, while we did try their (Shovlin's) Nirvana line of full latex mattresses, there wasn't enough variety in the comfort layers to find something comparable or better than the Milan innerspring and they were quite a bit more expensive (1k+ difference). Due to this, I'm having second thoughts about whether or not we should be further investigating whether or not there is a 100% latex mattress combination out there that will give us the feel of the Milan, but maybe at a lower cost and/or potentially have a longer expected lifetime?

I realize this indecision comes down to personal preference and the Personal Value Equation, but I'm conflicted and am looking for some guidance on how to maybe navigate through this since these innerspring mattresses seem to be constructed out of pretty much the highest grade materials.

The other difficulty with quantifying what type/thickness/density of latex would get us the feel we want is that it seems there are very few local vendors of 100% latex mattresses in our area (Brick, NJ 08723). There are some sellers about 30-60 minutes away who sell Savvy Rest and OMI, but I'm not sure what I'll glean from romping around on them if their specs aren't easily available.
- Dan G.

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Last edit: by steelwindmachine.

High Quality Latex vs Innerspring Quandary 03 Oct 2016 10:53 #2

  • phoenix
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Hi steelwindmachine,

My quandary is whether or not it's worthwhile for durability sake and bang for the buck to go with the Tri-Zone and a latex (Dunlop or Talalay) topper?

I realize this indecision comes down to personal preference and the Personal Value Equation, but I'm conflicted and am looking for some guidance on how to maybe navigate through this since these innerspring mattresses seem to be constructed out of pretty much the highest grade materials.


I'm not clear on all the specifics of the two "sleeping systems" you are comparing so I can't really make any meaningful comments about them. If you can list the type and thickness and density of all the polyfoam layers in both sleeping systems you are comparing (including any toppers) listed from top to bottom with one line for each layer it would be helpful. I'm also not clear if the 1" Talalay layer in the Milan is in the pillowtop section of the mattress or in the body of the mattress itself because the information you provided doesn't make clear what is in the pillowtop itself.

In very general terms though ... as long as all the materials and components in a mattress meet the minimum durability guidelines here and without regard to all the specifics of each mattress which I'm not clear on ... I would generally prioritize comfort, firmness, and PPP (how well you are likely to sleep) over durability (how long you are likely to sleep well).

Also in general terms ... if a mattress/topper combination is a good "match" for you in terms of comfort, firmness, and PPP and there are no lower quality materials or "weak links" in the mattress/topper combination then it would also have the advantage of being able to replace just the topper without replacing the entire mattress if it softens or breaks down before the upper foam layers in the mattress (which is likely because a sleeping system will tend to soften or break down from the top layers down) or if your needs or preferences change over time.

The other difficulty with quantifying what type/thickness/density of latex would get us the feel we want is that it seems there are very few local vendors of 100% latex mattresses in our area (Brick, NJ 08723). There are some sellers about 30-60 minutes away who sell Savvy Rest and OMI, but I'm not sure what I'll glean from romping around on them if their specs aren't easily available.


The only way to know for certain whether any mattress is a good "match" for you in terms of comfort, firmness, and PPP will be based on your own personal experience.

While knowing the specs that can affect the quality and durability of the layers and components in a mattress is always important ... unless you have a great deal of knowledge and experience with different types of mattress materials and components and their specs and different layering combinations and mattress designs and how they combine together and can translate them into your own "real life" experience that can be unique to you (which would generally be a very small percentage of people) ... I would tend to avoid using complex combinations of specifications to try and predict how a mattress will feel or perform for you. When you try and choose a mattress based on complex combinations of specs that you may not fully understand or only based on specs for single layers or components that may not be as relevant or meaningful as you believe they are then the most common outcome is "information overload" and "paralysis by analysis".

A latex/innerspring hybrid is also in a completely different category than an all latex mattress so it would be difficult to use one as a meaningful reference point for choosing the other one because every layer and component in a mattress will have some effect on all the other layers and components above and below them and on the mattress "as a whole". Both of them can make great choices but the choice between them would be more of a preference and budget choice than a better/worse" choice. There is more about innerspring/latex hybrids vs an all latex mattress in post #13 here and the posts it links to.

Savvy Rest will tell you the type of latex (either 100% natural Dunlop or 100% natural Talalay) and the general firmness level (soft, medium, firm) for each of their layers. If you know the type of latex and the firmness level of each layer in one of their mattresses that is the best "match" for you then post #3 here includes a list of many of the online manufacturers that sell component latex mattresses with loose layers and zip covers as well and they would normally be available to use this information to suggest which of the options they have available would be the most closely comparable.

Phoenix
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High Quality Latex vs Innerspring Quandary 03 Oct 2016 12:05 #3

  • steelwindmachine
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Phoenix,

I've tried to restructure my post so as to better show the two mattresses from Shovlin that we're considering. These are both flippable mattresses. The Tri-Zone doesn't have an integrated pillow top, while the Milan does.

I list a separate pillow top that Shovlin offers as an accessory. With that on the Tri-Zone, we achieved a nearly imperceptible difference between it and the much more expensive Milan pillow-top model. We are considering going with the Tri-Zone and maybe an aftermarket latex topper instead of the Shovlin polyfoam for increased durability. Maybe a 3" medium (25-36 ILD).

I'm going to try to get up to the store that sells Savvy Rest and see if they have anything that feels right to us.

I think I'm grappling with whether or not there could be any confidence in increased longevity of the Shovlin Tri-Zone mattress + aftermarket latex topper vs. going with a 100% latex mattress that may or may not have interchangeable layers and/or could be augmented with an additional latex topper.

Ugh, decisions on feels =\

I guess the weakest link in both of the Shovlin mattresses is the high density polyfoam.
- Dan G.

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Last edit: by steelwindmachine.

High Quality Latex vs Innerspring Quandary 03 Oct 2016 13:17 #4

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Hi steelwindmachine,

I list a separate pillow top that Shovlin offers as an accessory. With that on the Tri-Zone, we achieved a nearly imperceptible difference between it and the much more expensive Milan pillow-top model. We are considering going with the Tri-Zone and maybe an aftermarket latex topper instead of the Shovlin polyfoam for increased durability. Maybe a 3" medium (25-36 ILD).


This is what is somewhat confusing to me because both mattresses WITHOUT a topper appear to be almost the same with the only difference between them (based on the specs you listed) being that one has 1" of 2.4 lb polyfoam and the other one has 1" of latex and that one has a separate cotton insulator pad in the center third of the mattress. If the Tri-Zone with a topper feels very similar to the Milan without a topper then I would have thought that the differences between the two base mattresses would be more significant but of course I have no personal experience with either of them so there is no way for me to know for certain.

In any case .... even if these specs are correct I would need to know the density of the polyfoam layers in both mattresses and in the topper to make any meaningful comments about their durability.

I think I'm grappling with whether or not there could be any confidence in increased longevity of the Shovlin Tri-Zone mattress + aftermarket latex topper vs. going with a 100% latex mattress that may or may not have interchangeable layers and/or could be augmented with an additional latex topper.


A topper will generally improve the durability of the upper layers in the mattress underneath it and a Dunlop latex topper would be more durable than a polyfoam topper.

I guess the weakest link in both of the Shovlin mattresses is the high density polyfoam.


Based on the specs you provided the weakest link in both mattresses would be the 1.5" of Dacron in combination with the 1 5/8" layer of high density polyfoam (which doesn't include the density of the polyfoam). In the Tri-Zone the weakest link would probably be the topper but once again I don't know the density of the topper and it would also be replaceable so durability wouldn't be as big an issue as it would with materials that are inside the mattress itself that can't be replaced without opening up the mattress.

Phoenix
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Last edit: by phoenix.

High Quality Latex vs Innerspring Quandary 03 Oct 2016 15:55 #5

  • steelwindmachine
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I updated my post with they polyfoam densities.
- Dan G.

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High Quality Latex vs Innerspring Quandary 03 Oct 2016 16:05 #6

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Hi steelwindmachine,

Thanks for adding the densities.

All the polyfoam meets the minimum density requirements in the guidelines relative to a BMI range of less than 30 and the only less durable materials in the mattresses would be the 1.5" of Dacron but it's only 1.5" thick so if you are in a BMI range that is lower than 30 there would be no lower quality materials or weak links that would compromise the durability or useful life of either mattress.

A latex topper would be more durable than the polyfoam topper you were using for your testing and it would also have a different "feel" because latex is more resilient and has a different response than polyfoam but the only way to know for certain whether any specific latex topper would be a good match for you in terms of comfort, firmness, and PPP on top of a specific mattress would be based on your own personal experience on that specific mattress/topper combination.

Phoenix
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Last edit: by phoenix.

High Quality Latex vs Innerspring Quandary 08 Oct 2016 22:07 #7

  • steelwindmachine
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Today I drove just over an hour to Hibernate Bedding in Bernardsville, NJ and met up with their stockist Mike who was filling in for Scott. Apparently they just recently started carrying the SavvyRest line and he did have to call Scott to answer several of my questions about the construction of the floor models I tested.

I dialed in on the SavvyRest Serenity, 10" thick, 3 x 3" layers. It had split foam configurations that I could barely notice a difference.
  • Wood foundation w/ coconut husk between foundation and mattress to improve air circulation
  • Quilted cotton cover w/brass zipper
  • Separate 2” topper w/ soft Talalay

Right side
Top: 3” Talalay Soft
Middle: 3” Dunlop Medium
Bottom: 3” Dunlop Firm

Testing Notes:
Tried 1st
More IN feel with topper
Cradled w/topper, no perceivable pressure points
Mattress without topper was more supportive, more ON the mattress, but little to no pressure

Left side: All Dunlop
Top: 3” Soft
Middle: 3” Medium
Bottom: 3” Firm

Testing Notes:
Tried 2nd
Negligible difference from Right side with topper
Could barely perceive difference from Right w/o topper. Maybe slightly more firm (probably due to the Dunlop density?), but no detectable pressure points.
Had similar ON feel w/o topper

I didn't ask for a price, but this configuration for the mattress alone on SavvyRest's site is $4k+. This is quite a bit more than we were hoping to spend.

What I got out of the testing was that, yes, a full latex mattress can be comfortable for me (and I think my wife, we both sleep the same way, but she is out of the country at the moment). So, now I guess I need to bring my wife up there so she can get some first hand experience and then decide how or if we can find a online retailer where we can get something that works for us.
- Dan G.

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Last edit: by steelwindmachine.

High Quality Latex vs Innerspring Quandary 09 Oct 2016 11:42 #8

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Hi steelwindmachine,

What I got out of the testing was that, yes, a full latex mattress can be comfortable for me (and I think my wife, we both sleep the same way, but she is out of the country at the moment). So, now I guess I need to bring my wife up there so she can get some first hand experience and then decide how or if we can find a online retailer where we can get something that works for us.



Thanks for the update. It sounds like you found some layering combinations that you like if you decide to go with a component latex mattress and if your wife also likes one or more layering combinations then the online manufacturers that are in the previous list I linked for component latex mattresses should be able to tell you which of the options they have available would be closest to the combinations that both of you preferred.

Phoenix
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