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I know what I like, but it's all junk 09 Feb 2015 10:36 #1

  • Herdo
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Hello everyone. I am in the process of shopping for a new mattress with my wife. We went out yesterday sort of on a whim and started browsing mattress stores. I had done some research a couple months ago because researching everything I buy is second nature to me. I had previously read some reviews on sleeplikethedead and knew latex and memory foam mattresses are highly regarded.

Early into our shopping we both agreed on one thing; memory foam is not for us. We both already knew that but thought we'd give it a try while we were looking and it felt just like we remember. It's like laying in quicksand or maybe a non-newtonian fluid?

We ran across a couple latex beds that were for the most part latex "comfort layers". Not as comfortable as I thought, but much better than the memory foam ones we tried. We live in Phoenix and there are several highly rated manufacturers in our area that we are going to try before writing off latex beds all together. The Brooklyn Beds 14" Aloe Alexis is one we are very interested in trying.

Overall we ended up agreeing that we both love the feel and support of inter-spring mattresses, specifically the "hybrid" mattresses. The first one we both really liked was the Serta iSeries Hybrid Sleep System. This one is a pocketed coil bed with a gel/foam comfort layer that just felt great. They also had the iSeries Profiles Hybrid Sleep System which felt much more like a memory foam bed. Looking on the Serta website, I can see it says it has "EverFeel™ Technology" which mentions the "cradling of memory foam". What exactly is that? It appears they both use the same "gel infused memory foam" so what is it exactly that makes the Profiles series more memory foam like? Narrowing that down would be a big help so we know what to avoid.

The second one we loved was the Sterns and Foster Lux Estate® Emmie-Rose 17.5" Plush Pillow Top. Holy cow. Laying on this bed was like laying on a cloud. A pillowy but supportive cloud. This was probably the most comfortable bed I've ever laid on. We saw this bed at two different stores and both sales representatives told us "it's not technically a hybrid, but it's got a mix of foams and springs". It's a bit pricey, but neither of us minded the price given how amazing it felt. Unfortunately, upon arriving home I learned that this is probably not only the worst reviewed bed in the history of beds, but maybe the worst reviewed item in history. I read through dozens of reviews and saw maybe one rating above two stars. Countless people mentioned the thing started to sag or literally fall apart within a couple months. Apparently it's just awful.

After yesterday, I've been reading through some of the guides and tutorials found here. I am still confused, but know for the most part I want to stay away from most major brands. The problem I am having, is that most of the high quality manufactures I've found through this forum produce latex or other foam beds. Like I said earlier, we haven't written off latex beds entirely, but we both really like inter-spring and hybrid beds.

So I guess my main question is, are there any reputable manufacturers of inter-spring and hybrid beds? We know what we are looking for, we just don't know where to start looking.

Thanks for taking the time to read this.

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I know what I like, but it's all junk 09 Feb 2015 13:48 #2

  • phoenix
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Hi Herdo,

Looking on the Serta website, I can see it says it has "EverFeel™ Technology" which mentions the "cradling of memory foam". What exactly is that? It appears they both use the same "gel infused memory foam" so what is it exactly that makes the Profiles series more memory foam like? Narrowing that down would be a big help so we know what to avoid.


Unfortunately Serta doesn't fully disclose the type and quality of the materials in their mattresses and also tend to use lower quality and less durable materials in their comfort layers as well and unless you are able to find out all the information you need to make an informed choice about a mattress (see this article ) I would avoid them completely (see the guidelines here ).

There are many different types of memory foam that have different properties (see post #9 here and post #8 here ) but the reason that a mattress has a memory foam "feel" is always because it contains memory foam but different types or thicknesses of memory foam or using memory foam in combination with other more resilient materials will affect how "memory foam like" a mattress feels.

While they don't disclose the specifics of their everfeel layer they do describe it as ...

our exclusive EverFeel technology, designed to feel like memory foam but without the need for time or temperature to adapt to your body.


Which means that it's most likely to be a higher density polyfoam that has been manufactured to have "some" of the pressure relieving properties of memory foam but with a more resilient response that will modify the typical "feel" of the memory foam so that you aren't "in the mattress" as much. There is more about these types of polyfoam in post #2 here .

The second one we loved was the Sterns and Foster Lux Estate® Emmie-Rose 17.5" Plush Pillow Top. Holy cow. Laying on this bed was like laying on a cloud. A pillowy but supportive cloud. This was probably the most comfortable bed I've ever laid on. We saw this bed at two different stores and both sales representatives told us "it's not technically a hybrid, but it's got a mix of foams and springs". It's a bit pricey, but neither of us minded the price given how amazing it felt. Unfortunately, upon arriving home I learned that this is probably not only the worst reviewed bed in the history of beds, but maybe the worst reviewed item in history. I read through dozens of reviews and saw maybe one rating above two stars. Countless people mentioned the thing started to sag or literally fall apart within a couple months. Apparently it's just awful.


I'm glad you found us before you decided to purchase a major brand innerspring mattress which uses lower quality materials in the comfort layers (which is the primary reason for foam softening or sagging issues).

There is more about the most important parts of the "value" of a mattress purchase in post #13 here which can help you make more meaningful comparisons between mattresses and help you make a more durable choice because no matter how a mattress may "feel" in a showroom ... if it doesn't use good quality and durable materials in the comfort layers especially then what you feel in a showroom or when a mattress is still relatively new won't last nearly as long as it should relative to the price you paid before you lose the comfort and support that was the reason you purchased it in the first place.

After yesterday, I've been reading through some of the guides and tutorials found here. I am still confused, but know for the most part I want to stay away from most major brands. The problem I am having, is that most of the high quality manufactures I've found through this forum produce latex or other foam beds. Like I said earlier, we haven't written off latex beds entirely, but we both really like inter-spring and hybrid beds.

So I guess my main question is, are there any reputable manufacturers of inter-spring and hybrid beds? We know what we are looking for, we just don't know where to start looking.


You may have seen this already but the better options or possibilities I'm aware of in the Phoenix area are listed in post #2 here and there are certainly many innerspring or innerspring hybrid mattresses available to you including some that are made by the members of this site that are in the Phoenix area.

Phoenix
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I know what I like, but it's all junk 10 Feb 2015 10:13 #3

  • Herdo
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Wow. thank you so much Phoenix. You are truly making this experience a lot easier for everybody who visits your site. I've been looking at the Charles P. Rogers beds which seem to fit all of the criteria for what we are looking for. I contacted one of their sales representatives earlier who was very open and knowledgeable about the materials used in their Powercore Estate 9000 models.

Asked a few questions and he gave me a quick rundown of all the materials and layers. I assume the latex layers are from the bottom up:

all natural Talalay latex

4" of latex

2" of a firm latex

1" of a softer latex

1" of a gel based latex that is also soft

About 1200 springs in the King. Different gauges in different areas.

Manufactured in New Jersey (at least the Powercore models are) and he said even the springs are manufactured in their New Jersey factory as well.


It sounds like they use high quality materials. I wasn't too sure what else to ask to look for "weak points" as you like to say Phoenix. :lol:

Right now this is the bed we are leaning towards I think.

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I know what I like, but it's all junk 10 Feb 2015 13:29 #4

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Hi Herdo,

Thanks for sharing the specs of the Powercore Estate 9000 mattress ... I appreciate it :)

As you may know from some of the information on the forum in post #34 here (and the rest of the topic) and in this topic there has been some question about whether Charles P Rogers would disclose the specifics of all the materials and components in their mattresses and it's great to see that at least for this mattress they were willing and able to provide you with the information you need to make an informed choice.

It sounds like they use high quality materials. I wasn't too sure what else to ask to look for "weak points" as you like to say Phoenix. :lol:


If these are all the layers and components in the mattress and nothing is missing (and you could check this by adding up the thickness of the layers and the thickness of the innerspring to make sure they add up to the thickness of the mattress) then there are no lower quality materials or weak links in the mattress. The layers you listed are 8" thick and the Powercore Estate 9000 is 15 1/2" thick which would mean that the pocket coils would need to be about 7" thick for all the layers and components to "add up". While all latex is a high quality and durable material relative to other types of foam ... I would also want to know whether the Talalay latex was blended or 100% natural so you can make more "apples to apples" comparisons with other mattresses.

EDIT: there are more complete specs for this mattress in post #1 here and while it only has 4" of latex not the 8" that was being discussed here (the first 4" spec was the total and the other layers were the makeup of the 4" total) ... the polyfoam layers are in the range that wouldn't be a durability issue so there are no obvious weak links in this mattress.

If it compares well to other mattresses you have tested in terms of PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and Personal preferences) and also compares well to your other finalists based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you (including the price of course and any return or exchange options that they offer) then it would certainly be well worth considering as your final choice .

Phoenix
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Last edit: by phoenix.
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