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Good Innnerspring Mattress with Minimal Foam 12 Aug 2014 00:36 #1

Hi, I'm looking to get a really good quality innerspring mattress to go with a soft, latex topper to create my bed. I'm not sure where to start, as mattress stores & salesmen aren't too helpful. From reading things here and elsewhere, I do understand the basic 'concepts'. Just need to translate that to real products.

Here's some things I'm looking for:
  • - Queen size
  • - As minimal of included padding as possible, as I'll be using a latex topper for cushioning (I'm assuming 3" soft should be OK here?). This seems to be the toughest issue.
  • - Really good quality innersprings (pocketed coil?)
  • - I need really good support, as am a side sleeper and have bad back. I don't know if it is automatically considered 'firm' if I get minimal foam?!? I'm also pretty thin/light, though, and I do need ample padding as I get pressure-point pain (topper should do this, right?)
  • - I live in SoCal (LA) in case I need to be able to pick-up or have delivered
  • - I'm open to local/non-major brands if they have great reputation and quality standards
  • - I would like a good warranty and company that stands behind product
  • - I'm hoping since it will be fairly basic I might be able to stay under $1000 (closer to $700 would be amazing). Don't need the best-of-the-best here, just good quality support.

I appreciate any help or direction on where to look. Thanks a lot!

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Good Innnerspring Mattress with Minimal Foam 12 Aug 2014 01:40 #2

Hi jethrodesign,

Hi, I'm looking to get a really good quality innerspring mattress to go with a soft, latex topper to create my bed. I'm not sure where to start, as mattress stores & salesmen aren't too helpful. From reading things here and elsewhere, I do understand the basic 'concepts'. Just need to translate that to real products.


The first place I would start is the tutorial post here which has all the basic information, steps, and guidelines that you will need to make the best possible choices ... and know how and why to avoid the worst ones.

You can also see my thoughts about buying a mattress/topper combination in post #2 here and unless you can test the combination in person (in which case it can be a good option if there are no lower quality materials in the mattress) then it's usually a more effective strategy to look for a mattress that already has the latex inside it that you would otherwise be adding as a topper.

Some of the better innerspring/latex hybrid options I'm aware of are listed in post #2 here .

It may also be worth considering a latex/polyfoam hybrid and some of the better latex and latex/polyfoam hybrid options I'm aware of that are also in lower budget ranges are listed in posts #3 and #4 here .

- I live in SoCal (LA) in case I need to be able to pick-up or have delivered


I'm not sure where you are in Southern California but if you are in the Los Angeles region then the better options and possibilities I'm aware of are listed in post #2 here and the list for the San Diego area is in post #2 here .

Phoenix
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Last edit: by phoenix.

Good Innnerspring Mattress with Minimal Foam 13 Aug 2014 01:21 #3

You can also see my thoughts about buying a mattress/topper combination in post #2 here and unless you can test the combination in person (in which case it can be a good option if there are no lower quality materials in the mattress) then it's usually a more effective strategy to look for a mattress that already has the latex inside it that you would otherwise be adding as a topper.


Thanks for the advice. Unfortunately for me, I work a great deal and in my limited time (maybe a couple hours on some Saturdays), I have been unable to find many places that carry any types of mattress toppers or many mattresses that don't have a fair amount of foam/comfort layers built-in. Hence my post here.

I've only located one place I could get to that had 1 latex topper in stock. I 'believe' it was about 3" and the salesperson said that it was very soft (less than 20ILD). In my limited time in the store, I did like the feel of it. But they didn't have any real 'basic' firm mattresses base to try it with, so I put it on a mattress that was the least 'pillow-toppy'. Seemed to be fine, if a bit soft due to the mattress being a bit soft.

- I was just hoping someone else in my position, needing a good quality innerspring mattress with minimal comfort layers built-in, might be able to chime in with what they've found. I wish I had tons of time to drive all around the place and find these on my own, but unfortunately, work does not allow.

I looked a bit into a per-constructed mattress with innerspring/latex, but honestly, it really seems like I would be much more limited in what I'd be able to find and it seems to be more expensive overall. And in the end, if I found after a couple weeks/months that it just wasn't working for me, I'd have to replace an entire mattress instead of possibly just a $300-400 topper. I imagine a good quality support layer should be a good quality support layer (using differential construction concept). I can't tell any difference when trying a firm mattress on their own - their all just hard.

Thanks!

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Good Innnerspring Mattress with Minimal Foam 13 Aug 2014 01:33 #4

Hi jethrodesign,

- I was just hoping someone else in my position, needing a good quality innerspring mattress with minimal comfort layers built-in, might be able to chime in with what they've found. I wish I had tons of time to drive all around the place and find these on my own, but unfortunately, work does not allow.


I think your most effective approach would be to talk to some of the many options on the list on the phone so that you can narrow down your choices before you take the time to visit them.

There are many manufacturers on the list that would probably have mattresses that fit your criteria. Just one of them for example is Flexuscomfort which is one of the members here and makes a range of good quality/value double sided innerspring mattresses that would likely be suitable for what you are looking for and they also carry latex toppers so you could actually test some combinations in person.

Phoenix
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Last edit: by phoenix.

Good Innnerspring Mattress with Minimal Foam 27 Aug 2014 02:17 #5

OK, I finally had a Saturday afternoon free and did as much local shopping as I could. The amount of details I could get from the salesmen in the stores varied, but I tried to get as much as possible.

If I tried any of the beds, they did seem to vary a bit in firmness, but I believe I may have mostly been feeling any soft cushioning that might have been in the quilting layer. So if there was a fair amount of soft foam in the quilting, it felt a bit softer than a couple that had very high ILD HD foam on top. They all felt too firm to sleep on (expected), but some felt like rocks. I didn't expect to like any as-is.

Only one place (PJ's) had any kind of a soft latex topper to try. There's was a Pure Latex Bliss 3", probably pretty low ILD (very soft). I did try it on a couple firm beds they had, including a VERY firm Stearns & Foster, and I think it should be OK. But I won't know for sure until sleeping on it a while.

So here are some options I found. I would appreciate anybody's experience or insight into any of these mattresses or manufacturers:
  1. Sleep-n-Air
    12.75 Guage pocked coil springs; foam encased; about 2" of poly foam on top
    $699. 10-year warranty. Read they have pretty strict no-return policy
    This mattress felt firm but there was definitely a bit of padding in the quilting.
  2. Flexus - Posture Sense
    15-15.5 Guage 'tri-zone' pocked coil springs; foam encased; about 1.5" 'Certi-Pure' 1.5lb poly foam; 1" Bamboo quilt
    $475. 15-year warranty
    Didn't try this one, only called.
  3. Stress-O-Pedic - Christalle X-Firm
    14.5 Guage 621 Marshall coil springs; foam encased; 2" HD reflex foam (1.7lb / 55 ILD); Quilting: 7/8" 1.2lb 17 ILD + 1/2" Puralux Latex.
    $750. 15-year non-prorated warranty
    This was VERY firm and looked pretty well-made.
  4. Custom Comfort - Revive 100
    Medium-firm springs (I believe they mostly do Bonnell or Continuous?!? Will do pocked coil as custom); Steel edge support; natural cotton padding + quilted plush top
    $780 ($930 w/ pocked coils). 90-day comfort guarantee. 15-year warranty
    Didn't try this one. Store felt most high-end and salesperson very knowledgeable. Seems like they will stand behind their product well.
  5. Mattresses.net - DIY Latex Core
    6" Latexco Dunlop 15% Natural, 85% Syn, 100% Pure Latex Rubber core; 30 ILD (med) or 36 ILD (firm); bamboo/wool zippered cover
    $770. Unsure of comfort guarantee or warranty on these.
    Still wondering if this would be sufficient base instead of innerspring for support. I've tried a couple all latex beds and think I preferred feel of Dunlop (at least cores).

- Thoughts?!?

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Good Innnerspring Mattress with Minimal Foam 27 Aug 2014 03:00 #6

Hi Jethrodesign,

While I can't speak to how well any of these mattresses will work for you with any particular topper in terms of PPP ... I can certainly make some comments about them in terms of the quality of their materials.

Sleep-n-Air
12.75 Guage pocked coil springs; foam encased; about 2" of poly foam on top
$699. 10-year warranty. Read they have pretty strict no-return policy
This mattress felt firm but there was definitely a bit of padding in the quilting.


I would want to know the density of the 2" polyfoam layer and to make sure that the specs include all the layers in the mattress. I can't make any comments here without knowing the density of the polyfoam.

Flexus - Posture Sense
15-15.5 Guage 'tri-zone' pocked coil springs; foam encased; about 1.5" 'Certi-Pure' 1.5lb poly foam; 1" Bamboo quilt
$475. 15-year warranty
Didn't try this one, only called.


This is a two sided mattress which would add to durability and there are no weak links in the design so it would certainly be a suitable option.

Stress-O-Pedic - Christalle X-Firm
14.5 Guage 621 Marshall coil springs; foam encased; 2" HD reflex foam (1.7lb / 55 ILD); Quilting: 7/8" 1.2lb 17 ILD + 1/2" Puralux Latex.
$750. 15-year non-prorated warranty
This was VERY firm and looked pretty well-made.


I believe this is a one sided mattress but it also uses good quality materials and there are also no weak links in the design and would be suitable as well. I'm not surprised it felt very firm to you with a 55 ILD comfort layer.

Custom Comfort - Revive 100
Medium-firm springs (I believe they mostly do Bonnell or Continuous?!? Will do pocked coil as custom); Steel edge support; natural cotton padding + quilted plush top
$780 ($930 w/ pocked coils). 90-day comfort guarantee. 15-year warranty
Didn't try this one. Store felt most high-end and salesperson very knowledgeable. Seems like they will stand behind their product well.


This is also a two sided mattress which would add to durability. I would want to know the details of the "quilted plush top" but assuming that there isn't too much lower quality material in the quilting then it would also be a durable design with no weak links in the design and would be suitable as well. A mattress with cotton padding is a little unusual in todays market and will tend to get a little firmer as the cotton compresses over time (see post #2 here ).

Mattresses.net - DIY Latex Core
6" Latexco Dunlop 15% Natural, 85% Syn, 100% Pure Latex Rubber core; 30 ILD (med) or 36 ILD (firm); bamboo/wool zippered cover
$770. Unsure of comfort guarantee or warranty on these.
Still wondering if this would be sufficient base instead of innerspring for support. I've tried a couple all latex beds and think I preferred feel of Dunlop (at least cores).


This is also a good quality material although it would be a little less resilient than 100% natural Dunlop. Latex is certainly suitable for a support core in a mattress (and many people prefer it over innersprings) and can provide very good support and alignment but the choice between latex and an innerspring is really a personal preference because they feel and respond differently from each other (see post #2 here ). It would also be suitable under a topper in the right firmness level but you would also need a mattress cover with this option (either for just the core or for both the core and your topper).

I think you've done well with your research and outside of the few I mentioned where you will need a little more information you have some good options that have no obvious weak links and would certainly be suitable for a base mattress under a topper. If motion transfer is an issue for you then I would also be aware that innersprings that are joined by helical coils will transfer more motion than pocket coils or latex. A box spring with springs can also transfer motion vs a solid non flexing platform or foundation.

Phoenix
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Last edit: by phoenix.

Good Innnerspring Mattress with Minimal Foam 29 Aug 2014 02:38 #7

Custom Comfort - Revive 100
Medium-firm springs (I believe they mostly do Bonnell or Continuous?!? Will do pocked coil as custom); Steel edge support; natural cotton padding + quilted plush top
$780 ($930 w/ pocked coils). 90-day comfort guarantee. 15-year warranty
Didn't try this one. Store felt most high-end and salesperson very knowledgeable. Seems like they will stand behind their product well.


I received a bit more info on the Custom Comfort mattress:

- 14.5 Gauge springs (pocketed coil) / or standard 13.75 gauge 'VertiCoil' (most of their mattreses use this).
- Standard foam is 1/2" 15 ILD. I'm guessing this is in quilting + any cotton batting (their higher end beds use mostly cotton batting).

Stress-O-Pedic
I believe this is a one sided mattress but it also uses good quality materials and there are also no weak links in the design and would be suitable as well. I'm not surprised it felt very firm to you with a 55 ILD comfort layer.


- Would having very firm HD foam in the top 'comfort' layer (tried a Stearns & Foster that was similar) prevent the coils from really adjusting to your body well, especially if using pocketed coils? Does it defeat any of the purpose, or does it just give it a firm feel without affecting it's support characteristics?

- Should I be concerned about any mattresses with a higher gauge wire for the coils (e.g., 15.5 for Flexus)?

Thanks! Maybe I'll get lucky and they'll have holiday sales this weekend. Hoping to make a decision soon.

Kenny

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Good Innnerspring Mattress with Minimal Foam 29 Aug 2014 10:07 #8

Hi jethrodesign,

I received a bit more info on the Custom Comfort mattress:

- 14.5 Gauge springs (pocketed coil) / or standard 13.75 gauge 'VertiCoil' (most of their mattreses use this).
- Standard foam is 1/2" 15 ILD. I'm guessing this is in quilting + any cotton batting (their higher end beds use mostly cotton batting).


With only 1/2 of polyfoam in the quilting there wouldn't be any "weak links" in this mattress either.

- Would having very firm HD foam in the top 'comfort' layer (tried a Stearns & Foster that was similar) prevent the coils from really adjusting to your body well, especially if using pocketed coils? Does it defeat any of the purpose, or does it just give it a firm feel without affecting it's support characteristics?


Every layer of a mattress will modify the feel and performance of every other layer to some degree. This is just how different mattresses are made to be suitable for different body types, sleeping positions, and preferences. Thicker or firmer layers on top of a pocket coil will have a bigger effect on how the pocket coil feels and performs than softer or thinner layers yes but this certainly wouldn't defeat the purpose of the pocket coil and for some people it would be better and for others it would be worse. Everything always depends on how all the layers and components interact with each other and with the person that is sleeping on it and how the mattress "as a whole" feels and performs for each person. While it's important to know the specs of a mattress to assess its quality and durability ... the suitability of a mattress (or a mattress topper combination) can only be known based on your own testing or sleeping experience.

- Should I be concerned about any mattresses with a higher gauge wire for the coils (e.g., 15.5 for Flexus)?


Outside of the steel being tempered, the most important "spec" of an innerspring that relates to its durability is the weight of the steel inside it. This comes from a combination of the gauge of the wire, the number of turns in the coil, the diameter of the coil, the number of coils in the mattress, any helical wires in the innerspring, and the height of the coil. The weight of the steel isn't a spec that you will be able to find out. Having said that ... the support layers of a mattress aren't generally the weak link of a sleeping system so unless the top layers of a mattress are very thin (comfort layers and any topper) or the person on the mattress is very heavy the innerspring won't be the most significant factor in the useful life of the mattress or sleeping system and I would focus more on the suitability of a mattress (which comes from the innerspring in combination with the other layers and any topper you are using) than I would on the durability of the innerspring.

Phoenix
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Good Innnerspring Mattress with Minimal Foam 01 Sep 2014 14:11 #9

Hi, I'm still trying to decide which would be the better way to go. But I found another mattress that seems like it would be ideal. It's just more than I'd like to spend (almost double).

Berkely Ergonomics - Interactive

Appears to have high-quality pocketed-coil springs (European bi-level?!?) and just a 2" latex top foam, with a cotton knit cover quilted with organic wool.
And apparently the springs come in a softer or heavier option, as does the latex foam. So there would be 4 firmness combinations. And the top zips off so the latex (and/or coils) could be swapped out if needed.

This sounds one of the better mattresses I've found, but is almost $1600 :(

- Is there anything else even similar to this a bit less expensive (pocketed coil + latex)? I imagine that might be hard to find.

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Good Innnerspring Mattress with Minimal Foam 01 Sep 2014 18:50 #10

Hi jethrodesign,

- Is there anything else even similar to this a bit less expensive (pocketed coil + latex)? I imagine that might be hard to find.


The Berkeley Ergonomic mattresses are certainly good quality/value choices but it's unlikely that you would find an "equivalent" mattress somewhere else outside of other mattresses that are in the same general innerspring/latex category. There is more about trying to "match" one mattress to another one in post #9 here but in most cases even seemingly minor changes between the designs of two mattresses can make a surprising difference in terms of how it feels.

There are other innerspring/latex hybrids in the Los Angeles list and some may be in lower budget ranges (you would need to spend some time on their websites or on the phone to find out what each of them have on their floor) but each of them would be different from each other so you would need to do some testing to make sure that any of them are just as good a "match" for you in terms of PPP because the suitability of a mattress is the most important part of the value of a mattress purchase (see post #13 here ).

Phoenix
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Last edit: by phoenix.
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