>

Welcome to The Mattress Underground FORUM! :cheer:
The first place to start your research is the Mattress Shopping Tutorial
Select the Search Forum tab below to gain access to answers to many mattress related questions.
Select the Ask An Expert tab below to reach out to any of our Expert Members for guidance and advice.

Welcome to The Mattress Underground FORUM! :cheer:
  • Page:
  • 1

TOPIC:

Help! 3 months left in comfort guarantee with Select Sleep Mattress (Union City, CA) 09 May 2014 21:33 #1

  • double_g
  • double_g's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • Junior Member
  • Junior Member
  • Posts: 2
Hi everyone,

First off, Phoenix - thank you for providing such a wonderful source of information about mattresses to help people sift through the often misleading information at most mattress stores!

I have been having lower back pain from our mattress since last summer. I was never sure about whether it was the mattress or not until I spent 2 weeks away from home over the holidays and was pain-free in the morning until returning back home. I am a stomach and side sleeper and was feeling pain in my lower back from what I suspect was sagging in the middle of the bed. My husband is a back and side sleeper and was also having issues with back pain when sleeping on his back.

We had a Simmons Beautyrest from September 2007 with individual pocket coils and a “plush firm” comfort layer. After checking out a few mattress stores, I stumbled upon your site and wanted nothing more to do with standard mattress brands.

After looking at your list of bay area stores and speaking with a few people from them on the phone, we decided on visiting Select Sleep Mattress in Union City. Our view was that it’s very difficult to get a sense of overnight comfort from a few minutes in the store so the 6-month comfort guarantee sold us as well as the wonderful service and extremely reasonable prices.

We started with a support layer of individual pocket coils topped with 2” of latex. Select Sleep only carries Dunlop, and we went with the synthetic variety. We figured we could increase with another 2” of latex if needed for an extra charge. (The way the comfort guarantee works is you pay the difference in cost but don’t get refunded for reductions in cost.)

I chose the soft for my half and my husband chose the firm. (Select Sleep only has 2 choices of firmness for their latex and they only provide them in 2” increments.) After a few nights, I realized I had made a mistake with the soft as I felt as I was sinking into the mattress when on my stomach and this was putting strain on my lower back. My husband was pretty happy with his firm latex on the pocket coils.

I called and spoke with Chong who said that while they don’t usually have choices in coil firmness, they had some firm coils and could switch them out for no charge. We agreed to switch the coils to the firmer ones and also switch my latex to firm.

This change improved things for a bit for me, but my husband is less comfortable with the firm pocket coils. In addition, I am still feeling some “sinking” and lower back pain when sleeping on my stomach, and some hip/shoulder soreness when sleeping on my side. The lower back pain suggests to me that I need something firmer for the support layer, but the hip/shoulder pain suggests that I need something softer for the comfort layer.

I’m hoping for some suggestions of what to try next. My thought is to add 2” of soft latex on top to add to the comfort but I am worried that I will have more of a sinking feeling rather than less. I would also like to consider options in 1” increments and hope that Select Sleep can order the appropriate layers even though they don’t carry them standard. Finally, I’m not sure what to add to my husband’s side to make the heights match given he was happy with his firm latex on pocket coils.

We still have about 3 months left of our comfort guarantee and I’d like to end up with a mattress that lets us both sleep comfortably!

Thank you in advance!

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Help! 3 months left in comfort guarantee with Select Sleep Mattress (Union City, CA) 10 May 2014 07:55 #2

  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Administrator
  • Administrator
  • Posts: 31963
Hi double_g,

Our view was that it’s very difficult to get a sense of overnight comfort from a few minutes in the store so the 6-month comfort guarantee sold us as well as the wonderful service and extremely reasonable prices.


This is a typical mistake that many consumers make and I would never buy a mattress based on the somewhat "false sense of security" of a comfort guarantee because knowing what changes you may need to make can sometimes be just as difficult as choosing the best mattress in the first place. As you can see in #10 in the guidelines here ... I would choose a mattress as if you only had one chance to choose the right one so that a comfort guarantee doesn't replace the need for good testing and is only used as backup insurance for something that you do everything you can to avoid (just like any insurance).

Careful and objective testing using the testing guidelines in the tutorial post can be much more accurate than you may realize for the large majority of people and is the most important part of a local purchase (see post #10 here and post #4 here ). This way you are much more likely to choose a mattress where only relatively minor fine tuning is necessary if any at all and where your initial choice is at least close to your ideal.

I’m hoping for some suggestions of what to try next.


Unfortunately I don't have enough knowledge or information about either you or your mattress to be a good source of guidance about comfort issues and these types of more complex situations have so many variables that they are usually best dealt with in person or with a much more detailed conversation on the phone with a retailer or manufacturer if "in person" isn't possible. I can't see you on the mattress or feel what you are feeling. They will know much more than anyone else (including me) about the specifics of their own mattresses and how all the materials and components work together with different people based on their experience and customer feedback than anyone else and wil be your best source of guidance. Don't forget that I have never seen or felt the mattress you are sleeping on and I have no experience with it or how the specific materials and components would work for me much less for someone else.

The more accurately you can describe your sleeping experience (types of symptoms you are having, how and where they occur, the sleeping positions they usually happen, and when you experience them) and how you would like to change your mattress then the better a retailer/manufacturer can help you with suggestions that can help you make that change within the limitations of what they have available.

Having said that ... there is more information in post #2 here and the posts it links to which talks about some of the more common symptoms that people may experience on a mattress and some of the possible reasons behind them that you may recognize in your own sleeping experience and may help you gain some clarity into the type of changes you want to make (either in the comfort layers for pressure relief or the support layers for alignment).

Combination stomach/side sleeping is by far the most difficult, risky, and most challenging sleeping combination of all because the needs of stomach sleeping are completely opposite to the needs of side sleeping. It's important to have "just barely enough" thickness and softness in the comfort layers of the mattress to provide good pressure relief on your side and no more than that along with a "firm enough" support core (especially under the pelvis which is the heaviest part of your body) so that you are as close as possible to the firmer support in the mattress to help keep you in alignment when you sleep on your stomach. A firmer middle zone or even a belly band (a layer in the middle of your mattress) can also help with this if that's an option that is available because it can allow for thicker or softer layers under your shoulders with less risk to alignment when you are sleeping on your stomach because a firmer middle zone can "stop" your heavier pelvis from sinking in as far and sleeping in a swayback position. The biggest issue for side sleepers is generally pressure relief and the biggest issue for stomach sleepers is generally alignment because of the tendency for the hips and pelvis to sag into the mattress and a firmer center zone and softer shoulder zone can sometimes help with both.

Other than this ... I think that the most effective suggestion I could make is now that you have some experience sleeping on your mattress and the "symptoms" you are experiencing you may be in a much better position to go back to the showroom and evaluate the differences between your mattress and the other options that they have available using the testing guidelines (making sure that you spent at least 15 minutes on every mattress you are considering after you have reached a "pre-sleep" state of complete relaxation). I would make sure that you "listen" very carefully for the more subtle cues from your body for any hint of "familiarity" or any of the early signs of the "symptoms" you are currently experiencing and that you hope to change.

I called and spoke with Chong who said that while they don’t usually have choices in coil firmness, they had some firm coils and could switch them out for no charge. We agreed to switch the coils to the firmer ones and also switch my latex to firm.


The change in coil firmness certainly makes sense for stomach sleeping and the lower back pain but I would have stopped there to see how it affected you because it's also not surprising that changing your comfort layer at the same time to a firm would would make your pressure issues worse on your side. This double change in firmness may have "jumped over" the combination that would have worked best for you or at least made it more difficult to assess what to do next because by changing both the support core and the comfort layer of the mattress at the same time it can make it much more difficult to decide which change in which layer or component did what. I would keep in mind that comfort layers and support layers each have different functions and while they interact together and affect each other ... one is more responsible for "allowing" your pressure points to sink in more and providing good pressure relief and the other is more responsible for "stopping" the heavier pelvis from sinking in too far and sleeping out of alignment.

It's also possible that "allowing" your upper body to sink in more with a softer comfort layer on your firmer innerspring may help your alignment as well because you may be sinking in more evenly with your upper body and it would certainly help with pressure relief.

I would also test the combination that your husband was sleeping on which is the softer innerspring with firmer comfort layers.

If neither of these prove to work well for you then the next logical step would be firmer support yet to prevent your pelvis from sagging or middle zoning and you would need to talk with them about these or any other options they have available. Once you have the alignment you need then you can build "comfort" and pressure relief on top of this. It's also possible that switching to natural Dunlop may be worth testing as well because it has a higher compression modulus which means it becomes firmer more quickly as you sink into it more deeply than the synthetic so it may work for pressure relief because of its initial softness and point elasticity (ability to contour to your body shape) but also be more supportive because of it's ability to resist deeper compression more effectively.

It's also possible that a change in pillow may help "enough" with any pressure issues on your shoulder so you can focus more on alignment . Stomach sleepers need a thinner pillow but this may be too thin for side sleeping so a pillow that can be "scrunched" may be worth considering so you can have the thinner pillow you would need when you sleep on your stomach but can fluff it up when you sleep on your side to keep your head and neck in alignment and take some of the pressure off your shoulders.

So overall if I was in your shoes ... I would go back to the showroom and test the softer latex over the firmer coils to see if this provides a better combination of pressure relief and alignment in all your sleeping positions and I would also test the softer coils with a firmer comfort layer and test the natural Dunlop to see which of these possibilities appears to work best for you and if none of these appear to be effective I would talk with them about what other options you would have.

Hopefully this will give you some reference points that you can test to confirm which of the guesses or "theory" will work for you in real life.

Phoenix
Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
Click here for TMU Discount Codes if purchasing from Our Trusted Members.
For any mattress questions Ask An Expert on our forum

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Help! 3 months left in comfort guarantee with Select Sleep Mattress (Union City, CA) 12 May 2014 21:18 #3

  • double_g
  • double_g's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • Junior Member
  • Junior Member
  • Posts: 2
Thank you for your detailed response!

I agree, changing both layers at the same time wasn't a great way to isolate the problem and detailed testing before purchase is ideal. Laying for 15 minutes on a mattress with a toddler in tow wasn't practical for us, but I'm going to sneak away from work to visit the showroom alone soon to diagnose properly. In the meantime I am sleeping with a pillow under my hips and it has helped tremendously!

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Help! 3 months left in comfort guarantee with Select Sleep Mattress (Union City, CA) 12 May 2014 21:58 #4

  • phoenix
  • phoenix's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Administrator
  • Administrator
  • Posts: 31963
Hi double_g,

In the meantime I am sleeping with a pillow under my hips and it has helped tremendously!


That's good to hear ... and it's certainly helped many other stomach sleepers as well.

Phoenix
Researching for a mattress?... Be sure to read The Mattress Shopping Tutorial.
Click here for TMU Discount Codes if purchasing from Our Trusted Members.
For any mattress questions Ask An Expert on our forum

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Help! 3 months left in comfort guarantee with Select Sleep Mattress (Union City, CA) 13 May 2014 09:00 #5

  • woofman
  • woofman's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Junior Member
  • Junior Member
  • Posts: 9
I would like to add to what Phoenix said about the firmer support layer and softer comfort layer. I did a lot of research, especially here. It took me over a year to make the purchase (actually I was looking far longer than that) and we got it dead on. My wife is mainly a side, stomach sleeper and myself a side, back and occasionally stomach sleeper (I use a pillow).

The best combo for us ended up being two natural Dunlop 3" layers (for the reasons Phoenix stated) and a fairly soft talalay layer also in 3". It allows my shoulder and hip great pressure relief when on my side (best I ever had) and due to our weight difference it supports her well when on her stomach. I had tried two layers of talalay and found poor support. I purchased multiple layers for a king bed so we could change them around and we both ended up on the exact same setup. In the end I found the natural Dunlop to be far more supportive. I too think you should have tried the firm springs with the softer comfort layer.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

  • Page:
  • 1
The Mattress UndergroundCopyright © 2022 The Mattress Underground
TheMattressUndergounf
TMU
TheMattressUndergounf