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Re: The Serta iComfort mattress ... what's the buzz 08 Oct 2011 15:46 #76

  • sleepy-in-az
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Hi Phoenix,

I'm back :blush:

So, we stopped by Sleep Ez... interesting little set up... DH did not like the Sleep Select systems. We tried a the ones that they had modeled and he just wasn't sold on them. We tried and liked the "LUXURION"- 3" Natural latex with 6" Soy base support foam-- It's not pillow top though.

The price is great and its comfortable, but I feel a little buyer's remorse :( It has to be made and we should have it by Wednesday, but now I am uncertain if I made the right choice, and I cannot find any reviews about this bed!:dry:

Can you tell me a comparable mattress to the 3" Latex / 6" Soy base support foam? I would just like to have more info than the brief description provided on the site (though, I did try it out in the store).

Thank you again for your help!

*Oh and I mentioned "mattress underground" and the woman that was helping us looked at me with a blank look... and come time to pay, the total didn't include a discount.... Didn't even think about it or realize it.

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Re: The Serta iComfort mattress ... what's the buzz 08 Oct 2011 18:01 #77

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Hi Lisa,

The most important part of any mattress is that it provides pressure relief and keeps your spine in alignment in all your sleeping positions. Everything after that is about durability (quality of materials and construction and how long will it perform these functions), preferences (all the subjective factors that are part of "comfort" for each person), and value (the price you would pay for one mattress that provides you with the "mix" of features that you need and want vs the price of another that will do the same). If a mattress doesn't do the two things that are most important (pressure relief and alignment), then no matter how good its "value" or quality or how good it feels in the store ... it isn't the mattress for that individual.

Every different type of material or mattress has a wide variety of different types and layering and construction methods ... all of which are designed to help different people with different weights, body shapes, sleeping positions, preferences, and budgets to find a mattress that relieves pressure, keeps you in alignment, feels good while you are on it, and will last as long as your budget allows. There are stories of people who have purchased a $50,000 mattress that will last a lifetime, but the mattress didn't do what they needed and wanted it to do and it would be a lifetime of poor sleep. Many others purchase a "perfect" mattress for $500 or $1000 that will only last a few years ... but those few years would be years of great sleep. Others yet purchase a budget mattress that also didn't do what they needed or wanted it to do and they would have a few years of poor sleep.

No matter what your budget ... the most important part of buying a mattress is PPP. Pressure relief, Posture, and Preference. More than anything your budget will determine how "perfectly" and how long the materials and construction of your mattress does this.

Each consumer really faces a choice between learning how to "contruct" a mattress which satisfies all these things for them or finding a reliable outlet that can be trusted to do this for them. An online purchase will generally require more education to replace the ability to actually test the mattress. Most will choose a combination of the two (education and reliable advice from a knowledgeable outlet that has the customers best interest in mind). For most people ... the reliable advice is the most difficult to find and they often end up buying a mattress that is either completely overpriced or may have great value for someone else but doesn't have the PPP for that person.

Because there are so many variables ... the easiest and "best" choice for most is a local manufacturer. As a group they generally have much better value but most important of all ... they will have the knowledge and expertise to "fit" a mattress to your needs and preferences inside your budget. They will also be able to tell you why a mattress costs more or less than another so you can make informed choices. These types of factory direct outlets and/or sleep shops that sell mattresses that "fit" with great value are worth their weight in gold ... especially if you can actually go there and test their mattresses and take advantage of their expertise in person. Nothing will ever be as "accurate" as personally testing a mattress in combination with knowing how to compare one mattress to another.

Without knowing how or being able to test a mattress for how it fits you for PPP ... you are somewhat rolling the dice unless you or the place you buy it from knows how to "match" the online purchase with mattresses you have tested locally for PPP. If there is ever a choice between a local manufacturer (such as Flexus) or sleep shop who "knows their stuff", (and puts your needs, budget, and preferences above their profit) and an online purchase, there is no doubt in my mind that I would go with the local manufacturer or a sleep shop who sells them over an online purchase. Without taking into account how a mattress fits and interacts with your unique needs and preferences, then you may end up with a high value mattress (based on price, durability, quality and materials) that doesn't work for you.

All memory foam will soften (break in) over the first 90 days or so. The more closed cell and "slow reacting" varieties of memory foam more so than the more open cell (faster reacting) varieties. There is often a few week adjustment period as well for any mattress as your body lets go of its habitual sleeping patterns which are compensating for a worn out or inappropriate mattress and "relearns" to relax and sleep in alignment without having to tense muscles or constantly change sleeping positions to find pressure relief or relieve strain.

There is very little correlation between a mattress thickness and how appropriate it may be for you. Higher quality materials can and often should be used in thinner layers. If a mattress provides you with PPP ... then the thickness makes no difference. Any additional thickness above this is usually about buying unnecessary material.

Since you have already purchased the Sams Club mattress ... I would give it at least a few days to see how it goes and if the back pain changes in either direction. If it is clearly creating back pain (from sleeping out of alignment) ... then this would be more about how appropriate the layering was for you than about the material value of the mattress itself and I would certainly return it and "start again" ... with the help of a local manufacturer.

The rest, recovery, and healing we get from good and deep sleep IMO is too important to leave to chance alone. In a case like yours where there are high quality and value manufacturers and outlets so close to you ... this is where I would go if your mattress doesn't work out for you. "Better" is always more about how a mattress works for you than about the "commodity cost" of the materials in it.

Phoenix
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Re: The Serta iComfort mattress ... what's the buzz 08 Oct 2011 19:08 #78

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Hi Sleepy-in-AZ,

In general ... the material in a pillowtop and why it is there at all has more to do with a mattress than the actual fact that it has a pillowtop. While it is certainly a form of layering which can affect the feel of a mattress ... in most cases (especially with major manufacturers), pillowtops as they are most commonly made are mainly a way to cater to initial perceptions that don't lead to long term pressure relief, alignment, or comfort and are more often than not a way of selling more cheap foam than is necessary. What is in a pillowtop is always more important than the pillowtop style of contruction itself. A tight top mattress can be just as soft as a pillowtop if the right materials are used for the person ... and with most "mass market" mattresses ... pillowtops should completely avoided as they are no more than a way to add some cheap soft polyfoam (that will quickly break down) to a mattress and charge an inflated price.

To give you a "mass market" example of a major manufacturer that uses 3" of latex (a lower quality type of latex than yours) over a similar support base (High Density polyfoam) ... the Sealy Embody
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which sells for $1800 (queen mattress only) would be comparable. While this would be roughly comparable to what you purchased (yours uses higher quality latex though) ... both would feel different to different people depending on sleeping position, weight, height, and individual preferences. One person's "soft" is often another person's "firm" depending on the layers they are feeling in the mattress and their own sensitivity to pressure, spinal alignment, and subjective preferences and sensitivities.

A mattress review that is based on other people's perceptions about a mattress and that is given in the excitement of a new purchase means very little and is a major cause of poor choices in a mattress. Words like "soft", "firm", "comfortable", and "supportive" are usually misused and are often talking about different things and different mattress layers through the perceptions of different people with very different needs and preferences. The quality of materials used (durability) and how well a mattress provides pressure relief, alignment, and comfort for you are much more important than any review. Most people who submit a review of their mattress have little idea of the materials in their mattress or how long it will continue to "perform" in the same way it did when new and the reviews are based on fairly vague notions of initial "comfort". Personal testing and/or knowledge of the materials and layering in a mattress is really the only way to have an idea of how suitable a mattress will be for any individual or long it will last. Latex is the most durable of all foam materials (latex, polyfoam, and memory foam) and will keep its properties longer than any other foam. The HD polyfoam used under it is a good "budget" choice for a support layer under the latex (even though the embody isn't what I would call a "budget" mattress ... it should be).

Most people who purchase from Sleepez make their purchase online (they don't live in Phoenix) and Shawn (the owner) and the people who answer the phone are well aware of the discount for The Mattress Underground members. Since it is less common for the employees in the store to have a member buy a mattress in the case of SleepEz ... they may not all be aware of it. A quick call to Shawn at their online number and letting him know where you purchased it will rectify the 5% discount.

Congratulations on your purchase :). I understand the buyers remorse as most people have been somewhat "misled" into believing all the misleading advertising and stories that dominate the market or that "brand" is more important than materials and quality. You did well IMO.

Phoenix
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Re: The Serta iComfort mattress ... what's the buzz 08 Oct 2011 21:20 #79

Hi Phoenix,
I went to flexus comfort and tried their memory foam. The 5lbs seems much firmer and better for me than the one I got for Sams Club. I was talking with the rep and he said that if I have tried latex. He went to show me a full 100% latex bed that is flippable. The price is out of my range but he indicated I can work something out. My question is that when I laid on the latex bed it felt so good that I wanted to buy it. However I didn't do any research on latex at all and will be going in blindly. He was telling me they have a 6in latex for 1500 vs the 8 in latex for 1900. What is the difference between the 6inch and the 8inch?

Also what should I know before going back to them to ask them questions? Its a family own business and they make their mattress on site, so Is there anything I should be asking or I should know they have in the bed before committing?

Thank you again.

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Re: The Serta iComfort mattress ... what's the buzz 08 Oct 2011 23:29 #80

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Hi Lasdj,

The most important part of buying a mattress is to know the 2 basic functions of a mattress

Here's an article on the pros and cons of memory foam and here's an article on the pros and cons of latex .

My first priority would be to decide on what type of foam I wanted in the comfort layer (the upper few inches of the mattress). This is the layer that is mainly responsible for pressure relief and a big part of the "feel" of a mattress. The primary choices here are memory foam and latex ... both of which are about equal in pressure relief but different in feel (provided the latex is soft enough to provide adequate pressure relief as it comes in different ILD's or levels of firmness/softnes)

Following this is the decision about the material to use in the support layer. This will normally be either an innerspring, polyfoam, or latex foam. Memory foam cannot be used in the support layers as all memory foam is too soft for this. While latex is an excellent choice for this as different layerings and the nature of latex itself can provide support for a wide range of positions and sleeping profiles ... innersprings and polyfoam have a different feel and can be used either for their feel or for budget considerations (latex is the most expensive and most durable support material but using polyfoam or an innerspring can reduce the cost of the mattress). Choosing a latex comfort layer over either innerpsprings or polyfoam is a common compromise to get the pressure relief and comfort of latex in a lower budget mattress.

More information about the different materials used in the comfort layers of a mattress is here and in the sub pages and about the different materials used in the support layers of a mattress is here and in the sub pages.

In general ... when you find a quality local factory direct manufacturer that has been in business for many years ... their experience, expertise, and advice is usually good and can be trusted. Based on my conversations with Henry (the owner) Flexus is one of these and their advice regarding pressure relief, alignment, durability, and value would be valuable.

In general a "single core" of 6" latex can be very suitable for some people however a thinner softer 2" or 3" comfort layer over this can provide better pressure relief for many ... particularly for side sleeping ... while the core (latex, innerpring, or polyfoam) can provide the support that keeps your heavier parts (hips) from sinking in too deeply.

As long as you are testing a mattress for pressure relief in the position that has the most "pointy parts" (like hips and shoulders) and spinal alignment in all your sleeping positions, then everything else after this is a matter of preference (the different feels of latex, memory foam, innersprings, breathability, temperature, durability) and getting the best value within your budget. This is what I call PPP (pressure relief, posture, and preferences).

Finding a high quality and knowledgeable factory direct local manufacturer or sleep shop can save you a lot of research and learning ... while the articles I linked to should give you ideas about the types of questions you may wish to ask :).

Phoenix
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Re: The Serta iComfort mattress ... what's the buzz 09 Oct 2011 19:01 #81

  • xmrronnie
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Hi, I'm Ron and new here...I'm looking at the iComfort memory foam beds and am wondering if you know where I can get it at a discount, or a very similar bed (adjustable/wireless) at equal or lesser value than the iComfort in or around Indianapolis, IN?

Thanks!

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Re: The Serta iComfort mattress ... what's the buzz 10 Oct 2011 01:03 #82

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Hi Ron ... and welcome,

As you probably know from this thread ... I consider the iComfort to have poor value (as are most of the national brands compared to other higher quality less expensive choices made by independent manufacturers). In the same way, the adjustable base that is sold with it is also significantly more than other almost identical options although they do have a matching cover and a zipper attachment which others don't have. For reference ... the best prices I have seen for the major brands of adjustable bases are here so you can have a comparison before deciding whether it is worth purchasing the iComfort motion perfect base.

In terms of the mattress itself ... I normally recommend looking at local manufacturers for the best quality and value mattresses. For those who don't have a local manufacturer near enough to where they live, then "lay on mattress" testing done locally to find out the materials and layering of mattresses that best suits your needs and preferences can serve as a blueprint for an online purchase from a factory direct outlet which can help you to "duplicate" the type and layering of mattress you prefer.

Your better choices in the Indianapolis area are listed in post #2 here

I would certainly tend to avoid the Mattress World, Mattress Firm, American Mattress type of outlets that are quite common in your area and typically sell national brands which have much lower quality and value and who do everything they can to discourage comparative shopping based on actual materials in a mattress.

Some online memory foam mattress choices are in this thread .

Hope this helps.

Phoenix
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Re: The Serta iComfort mattress ... what's the buzz 10 Oct 2011 10:56 #83

  • LiLiBug
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Wow! :slaphead: I wish I woud have found this site before buying our mattress! We just bought a second home in AZ and while I am experiencing buyer's remorse, I do have a small silver lining. I am within the "60 day comfort guarantee" and want to return my mattress. Problem is that I can not "return" it for my money back just return it for a different name band mattress. We are considering the iComfort for no other reason other that they sell it there.

Any suggestions on other name brand mattresses that I won't want to throw out my window after a year?

Also, interestingly enough we also need a new mattress in our primary home in NH and was wondering if you have suggestions for manufacturers in that state!

Thank you so much in advance! Your information is invaluable!

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Re: The Serta iComfort mattress ... what's the buzz 10 Oct 2011 21:34 #84

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Hi LiLiBug,

It's too bad about the Arizona situation because AZ has some very high quality and great value mattress manufacturers. If you let me know the name of the store though, ... I'd be happy to take a look and see what they have that IMO may have better value.

There are not a lot of great options in NH but here are a few ... and if you are close enough to another state like MA to make a drive worthwhile, then there may be other options as well.

www.sunsetmattressfactory.com/index.htm Ossipee. Independent factory direct manufacturer that makes some "old style" and good quality innerspring/cotton mattresses with working box springs that are good value.

Milford. Retail direct outlet. Carries several memory foam and latex options from Therapedic which may have better than average quality and value.

Various NH and MA outlets. Retail direct outlet for Jordans Mattress Factory which has their own house brand (I would ignore the major brands they carry). Their memory foam mattress descriptions don't say the type of memory foam or density but the polyfoam used in the support core is a lower density/quality (1.6 lbs) than is usually used. Their latex over polyfoam mattress uses better quality poly under the latex but doesn't give the type or layer thickness of the latex which would be important to know (so you know that it's not just a meaningless layer hidden between other layers of cheaper foam).
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Post #4 here has a larger list centered in the Merrimack, NH area (including these three).

If a quality mattress that fits your needs and preferences and has good value is not available locally, ... then the mattresses that you have tested and provide the best combination of pressure relief, sleeping alignment, and your preferences can be used as a "guideline" for an online purchase which may have much better value than what is available locally.

Phoenix
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Re: The Serta iComfort mattress ... what's the buzz 11 Oct 2011 12:59 #85

  • LiLiBug
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Thanks Phoenix! It is Sleep America and I can not say that they haven't been extremely helpful and willing in taking our mattress back! Very accomidating!

We like the feel of the iComfort so something comparable would be nice. Also how can I negotiate the best price if in fact an iComfort is our only option?

Thank you so much, you really do provide a great source of reference!

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