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HELP TO DECIDE ON THE RIGHT MEMORY FOAM MATTRESS 21 Jan 2016 15:49 #1

  • kurniadion
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Hello:

Need your help in shedding more light into our decision making process in getting a bed replacement that will work for us. I'm 5'7" 135 lb and my wife is 5'1" 115 lb. We are primarily back sleepers. We have been having back pain on our leesa. We tried a few others that didn't work as well. We tried laying on tempurpedic contour rhapsody breeze and it seemed that we got the support we need. With that we came to conclusion that we wanted something that firm and made of quality memory foam rather than cheaper latex or other materials.

From what we learned, it seemed that the way to go is get a mattress with at least 5 lb of memory foam so we were a bit concerned since one or two options have 4 lb memory foam. What do you think considering our weight, height and sleeping position? Is 4 lb enough to give us that strong support we needed?

We would like to spend up to $1000 when possible however if there is no other option, we can spend up to $1500. The options so far:

1. Christeli Danieli 13.5" $1500
Their website stated that this model is very similar to tempurpedic contour rhapsody breeze

2. Loom & Leaf FIRM $1500
The staff said that this model is very similar to tempurpedic contour rhapsody breeze

3. Alexander Signature FIRM $1400
Their website stated that this model is very similar to tempurpedic contour elite, not sure if this will be too hard for us. Combination between 4 lb and 5 lb comfort layer.

4. Novosbed FIRM $1200
Combination between 4 lb and 5 lb comfort layer. The staff stated that the ILD of the top 2 layers for FIRM are 9 and 11, so I fear that the bed would be too soft although bottom layer is 32.

5. Ultimate Dream Aria $800 (Dreamfoam)
Consisted of only 4 lb memory foam layers. This would be an ideal price though. Haven't spoke to anyone yet.

Kindly let us know. Your help will be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

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HELP TO DECIDE ON THE RIGHT MEMORY FOAM MATTRESS 21 Jan 2016 17:52 #2

  • phoenix
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Hi kurniadion,

Need your help in shedding more light into our decision making process in getting a bed replacement that will work for us. I'm 5'7" 135 lb and my wife is 5'1" 115 lb. We are primarily back sleepers. We have been having back pain on our leesa. We tried a few others that didn't work as well. We tried laying on tempurpedic contour rhapsody breeze and it seemed that we got the support we need. With that we came to conclusion that we wanted something that firm and made of quality memory foam rather than cheaper latex or other materials.


While I can certainly help with "how" to choose ... I don't make specific suggestions or recommendations for either a mattress, manufacturers/retailers, or combinations of materials or components because the first "rule" of mattress shopping is to always remember that you are the only one that can feel what you feel on a mattress and there are too many unknowns, variables, and personal preferences involved that are unique to each person to use a formula or for anyone to be able to predict or make a specific suggestion or recommendation about which mattress or combination of materials and components or which type of mattress would be the best "match" for you in terms of "comfort" or PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your Personal preferences) or how a mattress will "feel" to you or compare to another mattress based on specs (either yours or a mattress), sleeping positions, health conditions, or "theory at a distance" that can possibly be more accurate than your own careful testing (hopefully using the testing guidelines in step 4 of the tutorial) or your own personal sleeping experience (see mattress firmness/comfort levels in post #2 here ).

I'm assuming that you've read the mattress shopping tutorial (which is the first place to start your research) but two of the most important links in the tutorial that I would especially make sure you've read are post #2 here which has more about the different ways to choose a suitable mattress (either locally or online) that is the best "match" for you in terms of "comfort" and PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and Personal preferences) that can help you assess and minimize the risks of making a choice that doesn't turn out as well as you hoped for and post #13 here which has more about the most important parts of the "value" of a mattress purchase which can help you make more meaningful quality/value comparisons between mattresses in terms of suitability (how well you will sleep), durability (how long you will sleep well), and the overall value of a mattress compared to your other finalists based on all the parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.

While I can't speak to how any mattress will "feel" for someone else because this is too subjective and relative to different body types, sleeping positions, and individual preferences, sensitivities, and circumstances ... outside of PPP (Posture and alignment, Pressure relief, and your Personal preferences) and how well you sleep the most important part of the value of a mattress purchase is durability which is all about how long you will sleep well on a mattress. This is the part of your research that you can't see or "feel" and assessing the quality/durability and useful life of a mattress depends on knowing the specifics of its construction and the type and quality of the materials inside it regardless of the name of the manufacturer on the label (or how a mattress feels in a showroom or when it is relatively new) so I would always make sure that you find out information listed here so you can compare the materials and components to the quality/durability guidelines here to make sure there are no lower quality materials or weak links in a mattress that would be a cause for concern relative to the durability and useful life of a mattress before making any purchase.

When you can't test a mattress in person then the most reliable source of guidance is always a more detailed conversation with a knowledgeable and experienced retailer or manufacturer that has your best interests at heart and who can help "talk you through" the specifics of their mattresses and the properties and "feel" of the materials they are using (fast or slow response, resilience, firmness etc) and the options they have available that may be the best "match" for you based on the information you provide them, any local testing you have done or mattresses you have slept on and liked or other mattresses you are considering that they are familiar with, and the "averages" of other customers that are similar to you. They will know more about "matching" their specific mattress designs and any firmness level options they have to different body types, sleeping positions, and preferences (or to other mattresses that they are familiar with) than anyone else.

1. Christeli Danieli 13.5" $1500
Their website stated that this model is very similar to tempurpedic contour rhapsody breeze


This mattress uses 5 and 6 lb memory foam and a 2.0 lb polyfoam base layer which exceeds the minimum guidelines that I would suggest and there are no lower quality materials or weak links that would compromise the durability or useful life of this mattress for any weight range.

If you have done some careful testing on the Tempurpedic Rhapsody Breeze and you are confident that it's a good match for you in terms of firmness and PPP then it would certainly be well worth considering.

They have a 50 day trial period that allows you to exchange the mattress (after you have tried it for a minimum of 30 days) for a different mattress that is softer or firmer but I would keep in mind that they don't currently offer returns or refunds if that is an important consideration for you.
ADMIN NOTE:Removed 404 page link | Archived Footprint: christeli.com/sleep-trial

2. Loom & Leaf FIRM $1500
The staff said that this model is very similar to tempurpedic contour rhapsody breeze


You can see some comments about the Loom & Leaf in post #2 here in the simplified choice mattress topic. I would be somewhat cautious here because of the convoluted layer of 4 lb memory foam in combination with their 1.5 lb base layer which is a lower density than I would normally like to see in this budget range.

They have a 75 day trial period which allows you to return the mattress but they do charge you for the cost of the original delivery (which would probably be under $100).

3. Alexander Signature FIRM $1400
Their website stated that this model is very similar to tempurpedic contour elite, not sure if this will be too hard for us. Combination between 4 lb and 5 lb comfort layer.


This mattress uses 4 and 5 lb memory foam and a 2.o lb polyfoam base layer which meets or exceeds the minimum foam quality/density guidelines that I would normally suggest so there would be no lower quality materials or weak links that would compromise the durability or useful life of this mattress relative to your weight range either.

If you have done some careful testing on the Tempurpedic Contour Elite and you are confident that it's a good match for you in terms of firmness and PPP then it would certainly be well worth considering.

They have a r101 day trial period which costs nothing if you choose to donate the mattress to a local charity to receive a refund (after you have tried it for at least 30 days) or costs $75 if you choose to return the mattress to Nest Bedding for a refund (again after 30 days).

4. Novosbed FIRM $1200
Combination between 4 lb and 5 lb comfort layer. The staff stated that the ILD of the top 2 layers for FIRM are 9 and 11, so I fear that the bed would be too soft although bottom layer is 32.


They use 4 and 5 lb memory foam and a 1.8 lb polyfoam base layer which meet or exceed the minimum guidelines that I would normally suggest so there are no lower quality materials or weak links that would compromise the durability or useful life of this mattress relative to your weight range either.

Every layer and component in a mattress (including the cover) will have an effect on the feel and performance of every other layer and component above and below it and ILD/IFD is only one of several variables or "comfort specs" that will determine how soft or firm an individual layer or a mattress "as a whole" will feel to different people (see post #4 here ). In addition to this the ILD/IFD of memory foam can change with temperature, humidity, and the length of time that a memory foam layer is continuously compressed (memory foam tends to get softer over the course of the night) and ILD/IFD testing with memory foam also produces different results than ILD/IFD testing on more resilient materials so the ILD/IFD of memory foam can often be more misleading than helpful. I would generally avoid using complex combinations of "comfort specs" that you may not fully understand to try and predict how a mattress will feel or perform for you or how it will compare to another mattress.

They have a 120 day trial period which allows you to return the mattress for a refund without any cost to you (after you have tried it for a minimum of 60 days).

5. Ultimate Dream Aria $800 (Dreamfoam)
Consisted of only 4 lb memory foam layers. This would be an ideal price though. Haven't spoke to anyone yet.


This mattress uses 4 lb memory foam layers and a 1.8 lb polyfoam base layer which meet the minimum guidelines I would suggest so there are no lower quality materials or weak links that would compromise the durability or useful life of this mattress relative to your weight range either.

If you have done some careful testing on the Tempurpedic Rhapsody Luxe and you are confident that it's a good match for you in terms of PPP then it would certainly be well worth considering.

If you order from the Dreamfoam website then they have a 45 day trial period (click dreamfoambedding.com/ lean more at the bottom left of the page) that allows you to return the mattress for a fixed $99 return shipping charge.

Novosbed, Nest Bedding, and Dreamfoam are also members of this site .

Once you have narrowed down your options to a list of finalists that are all choices between "good and good" and none of them have any lower quality materials or "weak links" in their design relative to your weight range and if there are no clear winners between them (which is usually a good indication that you have done some good research) then you are in the fortunate position that any of them would likely be a suitable choice and post #2 here can help you make a final choice based on your local testing or mattresses you have slept well on, your more detailed conversations about each of them, your confidence about PPP and the suitability of each one, their prices, your preferences for different types of materials, the options you have after a purchase to fine tune the mattress or exchange or return the mattress or individual layers, any additional extras that are part of each purchase, and on "informed best judgement" based on all the other objective, subjective, and intangible parts of your personal value equation that are most important to you.

You are certainly looking at some very good quality/value finalists and I'm looking forward to finding out what you end up deciding

Phoenix
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HELP TO DECIDE ON THE RIGHT MEMORY FOAM MATTRESS 21 Jan 2016 18:40 #3

  • kurniadion
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Thanks a lot for such a prompt response Phoenix. I really do appreciate it.
Yes, I believe I have read all of them and I came up with all those based on your suggestions on this forum.

I'll keep you posted. You're the best!

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HELP TO DECIDE ON THE RIGHT MEMORY FOAM MATTRESS 21 Jan 2016 18:52 #4

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Loom and leaf representative said this about the base foam:

"We use 4 lbs support foams that are 5.5" thick. All of the foams we use in our mattress are bio based. Please know that our foams density range from 1.3 - 1.8 ILD"

Did they change things?

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HELP TO DECIDE ON THE RIGHT MEMORY FOAM MATTRESS 21 Jan 2016 20:52 #5

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Hi kurniadion,

You can see some of the specs of their mattress here .

From the top down the foam layers include ...

5/8" of quilting foam (polyfoam that is quilted to the cover). This is typically a lower density material but since it isn't more than "about an inch or so" thick it normally wouldn't have a meaningful effect on the durability or useful life of a mattress unless there are also other layers in the mattress that are lower density as well.

The top comfort layer is a thin layer of a soft solid gel material that covers the middle section of the mattress and would add some additional firmness and support under the heavier part of the body (hips/pelvis) and would provide some cooling benefits in this area of the mattress as well. It's a good quality and durable material.

The next layer down is a 2" layer 4 lb convoluted gel memory foam. Convoluting would reduce the durability of this layer to a "functional equivalent" that was less than 4 lb density (a solid layer will generally be more durable than a convoluted layer that is the same type and density) so this would be a reason for caution (particularly in combination with other lower quality/density materials). You can read a little more about convoluted layers in post #2 here .

The next layer down is 2.5" of 5 lb memory foam. This is a good quality and durable material.

The next layer down is 2" of polyfoam

At the bottom of the mattress is 5.5" of polyfoam.

They told me in a chat that these bottom two layers are between 1.5 lb and 1.8 lb density (see post #2 here ). When a manufacturer gives you a density range like this I would assume that it is the lower of the two densities (it's a much less risky assumption). These are also the layers they were referring to when they told you they were using 1.3 - 1.8 "ILD" but the person you were talking to clearly didn't know the difference between ILD and density (they told me "units" which also doesn't make much sense). If they are now telling their customers that the density range is 1.3 - 1.8 lbs density (instead of 1.5 - 1.8 lb density) then this would either be a mistake or it would be an even lower quality/density material than they told me and if this is correct then I would assume that they were the lower part of the range they gave you which would be even worse. Their customer service representatives seem to commonly mix up their terminology and don't appear to be particularly knowledgeable about mattress materials.

You can see some comments about "so called" bio based or plant based foam materials in post #2 here and this is more about marketing than anything meaningful and is somewhat misleading because the polyfoam and memory foam is still mostly petrochemical based ... not "bio based".

You can also see some comments about their so called "natural thistle" fire barrier in post #4 here . The thistle is just the source for the cellulose that is then processed to produce the viscose/rayon in their fire barrier.

If their "organic cotton" cover is similar to the "organic cotton" cover used in the Saatva mattress (which it likely is since Saatva is their sister company) then it only includes 40% organic cotton blended with polyester.

In other words there is some greenwashing happening in their descriptions (although there are many other manufacturers in the industry that also have some misleading descriptions that imply that their materials are more "natural" or "green" than they really are)..

Phoenix
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HELP TO DECIDE ON THE RIGHT MEMORY FOAM MATTRESS 22 Jan 2016 15:31 #6

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Thanks again Phoenix. Its really clear. Yes, I think the rep mixed things up.

We will pull the trigger today. I think we will go for the Dreamfoam's Ultimate Aria. We will keep you updated. Many thanks again.

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HELP TO DECIDE ON THE RIGHT MEMORY FOAM MATTRESS 22 Jan 2016 18:20 #7

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Hi kurniadion,

We will pull the trigger today. I think we will go for the Dreamfoam's Ultimate Aria. We will keep you updated. Many thanks again.


Assuming that you decide to pull the trigger on the Dreamfoam Aria ... congratulations on your new mattress :)

I'm looking forward to your comments and feedback once you've received it and have had the chance to sleep on it for a bit.

Phoenix
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